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Obama, eyes on Vatican meeting, cites areas of cooperation
President favors 'robust' conscience clause for health care workers
Jul. 02, 2009
NCR Publisher Joe Feuerherd and Obama (White House photo)
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Pope Benedict XVI has “taken extraordinary leadership” on a host of issues that could form the basis for additional U.S.-Vatican cooperation, President Obama told religion writers at the White House earlier today. Obama and the pope are scheduled to meet for the first time at the Vatican July 10, following the president’s participation in the three-day meeting of the Group of Eight industrialized countries.
The areas of additional cooperation between the Holy See and the United States could include, said the president, Middle East peace, worldwide poverty and climate change.
On one level, said Obama, the papal-presidential meeting represents typical diplomatic exchanges that take place “with any other government.” But, he continued, “this is more than just that.” Said Obama: “The Catholic church has such a profound influence worldwide and in our country. The Holy Father is a thought leader and an opinion leader on so many wide-ranging issues and his religious influence is one that extends beyond the Catholic.”
“From a personal perspective,” said the president, “having a meeting with the Holy Father is a great honor and something I’m very much looking forward to.”
The president responded to eight questions during the 45-minute Roosevelt Room briefing. Among the issues he addressed:
- Federal protections for health workers who choose not to participate in procedures, such as abortion, that violate their religious or ethical beliefs. The Obama administration rescinded “conscience clause” provisions promulgated by the Bush administration as Bush’s term drew to a close. “I think that the only reason that my position may appear unclear is because it came in the wake of a last-minute, eleventh-hour change in conscience clause provisions that were pushed forward by the previous administration that we chose to reverse,” said Obama. “But my underlying position has always been consistent, which is I’m a believer in conscience clauses. I was a supporter of a robust conscience clause in Illinois for Catholic hospitals and health care providers.” He continued, “I can assure all of your readers that when this review is complete there will be a robust conscience clause in place. It may not meet the criteria of every possible critic of our approach, but it certainly will not be weaker than what existed before the changes were made.”
- Assistance to countries and individuals especially hard-hit by the world economic crisis. The United States has “robust plan” to address the food security needs of poorer countries and will be promoting its approach at the G-8 meeting. But programs for the poor, he said, are not just international in focus. “I think what I’ll also want to talk to the Holy Father about is the need to initiate some core reforms not just oversees, but here in this country, that assure basic security for individuals in this country not only poor, but also middle class, who are extremely vulnerable to bankruptcy if they get sick, to flat wages and incomes, [which] are making it more and more difficult for them to live lives of dignity and security. So everything from our health care reform agenda to our approach to education I think is geared towards providing greater opportunity.”
- Administration efforts to promote areas of agreement among abortion-rights supporters and opponents. The president said he expects to receive recommendations from a working group that includes both pro-choice and pro-life advocates later this summer. Said Obama, “I can tell you, though, that on the idea of helping young people make smart choices so that they are not engaging in casual sexual activity that can lead to unwanted pregnancies, on the importance of adoption as a option, an alternative to abortion, on caring for pregnant women so that it is easier for them to support children, those are immediately three areas where I would be surprised if we don’t have some pretty significant areas of agreement.” The president said there would undoubtedly be areas — he specifically mentioned contraceptive services — of continued disagreement. But, he continued, “I don’t know any circumstance in which abortion is a happy circumstance or decision, and to the extent that we can help women avoid being confronted with a circumstance in which that’s even a consideration, I think that’s a good thing.”
Obama’s meeting with the pope follows the controversy surrounding his recent commencement address at the University of Notre Dame, which raised the public ire of nearly 90 U.S. bishops who criticized the school for providing an honorary degree and a Catholic platform to a pro-choice president. Obama expressed no rancor toward those church leaders who spoke out against his presence at Notre Dame.
“Number one, one of the strengths of our democracy is that everybody is free to express their political opinions, and I take people’s opinions seriously,” said the president. “I’m the president of all Americans, not just the Americans who happen to agree with me.” Further, said Obama, “The American bishops have a profound influence in their communities, in the church, and beyond.”
The president noted, “Although there have been criticisms leveled at me from some of the bishops, there have been a number of bishops who have been extremely generous and supportive even if they don’t agree with me on every issue. So in that sense the American bishops represent a cross section of opinion just like other groups do.”
Meanwhile, said Obama, at a recent Oval Office meeting with Chicago Cardinal Francis George, president of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, “I expressed to him my interest in working in as constructive a manner as possible with the bishops on a range of issues.” Obama said his desire to work with church leaders is inspired by his experiences as a church-funded community organizer.
“You know, part of why establishing a relationship with the bishops is important to me is because I have very fond memories of Cardinal [Joseph] Bernardin, who was in Chicago when I first arrived to be a community organizer — funded in part by the Campaign for Human Development — and working with Catholic parishes on the south side of Chicago. And so I know the potential that the bishops have to speak out forcefully on issues of social justice.” Said Obama, “I think there are going to continue to be areas where we have profound agreements and there are going to be some areas where we disagree. That’s healthy.”
Asked whether he sometimes felt he has been “dragged into a largely intra-Catholic family fight” on issues that divide liberal and conservative Catholics, Obama again recalled Bernardin’s example, particularly as it relates to the “seamless garment” of life issues the late cardinal saw as integral to Catholic teaching.
“Cardinal Bernardin was strongly pro-life, never shrank away from talking about that issue, but was very consistent in talking about a seamless garment and a range of issues that were part and parcel of what he considered to be pro-life, that meant that he was concerned about poverty, he was concerned about how children were treated, he was concerned about the death penalty, he was concerned about foreign policy.
“And that part of the Catholic tradition is something that continues to inspire me. And I think that there have been times over the last decade or two where that more holistic tradition feels like it’s gotten buried under the abortion debate.”
The president continued, “Now, as a non-Catholic, it’s not up to me to try to resolve those tensions. As I said, all I can do is to affirm how that other tradition has made me, a non-Catholic, I think reflect on how I can be a better person and has had a powerful influence on my life. And that tells me that it might be a powerful way to move a broader set of values forward in American life generally.”
The president said that he and First Lady Michelle Obama have yet to decide on what, if any, religious congregation to join in the Washington area. The Obama family attends religious services when they spend the weekend at Camp David, he said, but may, in a concession to the disruption the president’s presence causes other worshipers, ultimately opt to rotate among different churches in Washington. In addition, said Obama, the controversy over his previous pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, “made us very sensitive to the fact that as president the church we attend can end up being interpreted as speaking for us at all times.”
In addition to NCR, the Catholic press represented at the briefing included representatives from America, Catholic Digest, Catholic News Service, Commonweal, the National Catholic Register, and Vatican Radio. From the secular media, a reporter from The Washington Post was present.
Joe Feuerherd is NCR publisher. His e-mail address is jfeuerherd@ncronline.org.
So, Notre Dame isn't suppose
So, Notre Dame isn't suppose to have President Obama speak at commencement but the Pope will meet with him. Do I have that right? Oh! Perhaps it was the giving of the honorary doctorate to which people objected. I get it. No I don't.
The Pope is granting him a
The Pope is granting him a visit, not honoring his views and politics and the Pope is always open, like Jesus Christ is to meet anyone and call to their attention the opportunity to teach them the truth and work with them to bring them back to God.
Looking back, the Holy Father
Looking back, the Holy Father used their meeting as a teachable moment, even giving Obama a copy of his encyclical to read for homework.
It seems he lost his copy. You can't be for the poor when you are doing all you can to kill their babies.
Personally, I would urge
Personally, I would urge President Obama to choose the option of rotating attendance at various churches of various denominations. If he were really adventurous he could invite leaders of various denominations and religions to accompany him and his family and to "tea" afterwards. He is signally qualified to demonstrate that belief in and respect for a personal "absolute reality" is shared by all in spite of and in respect for all the differences in nuance, large and small, but ultimately "nuance".
It is obvious, to me, that Obana is at once simple and wise. Listen and watch.
I don't expect any new
I don't expect any new opionion or pronouncement when Obama and the Pope meet. All you can do is pray, hope for the best and don't worry (ok, ok, I stole that from Padre Pio).
what a treat, that the
what a treat, that the President can comfortably ENGAGE the issues of contemporary religion (of all stripes) in a rational, measured way. I am proud to be a priest, an American, a catholic, and an Obama loyalist. I'll bet I'm not alone.
If there are more of you out
If there are more of you out there who are Obama loyalists then they must be in the closet cause they don't speak out in public......and I don't know how one can support an abortion president....the most supportive of abortion president....."thou shall not kill" what part of that don't you get if you are a priest.....
And what part of "Judge not
And what part of "Judge not lest you shall also be judged" don't YOU get???
"Thou shall not kill", aplies
"Thou shall not kill", aplies to more that abortion. Consider war,(there are combatant deaths and innocent civilians) capital punishment, lack of decent healthcare, lack of respectable living standards, Maybe the question is broader than you propose.
Father Mike, I am also proud
Father Mike,
I am also proud to be a Catholic, an Obama supporter and a Democrat. I encourage Catholic Democrats to join the LinkedIn Catholic groups (Catholic Professionals, Catholic Networkers, Knights of Columbus). I am horribly outnumbered there and could use some back-up.
if you are Catholic where did
if you are Catholic where did you learn the faith for God says in the ten commandments "thou shall not kill" how do you defend the killing of innocent unborn babies? You must not have a complete understanding of the Catholic Faith. Many people call themselves Catholic, but there is a difference betweent those who are faithful to the teaching of Jesus Christ and those who thing they can pick and choose what they want to believe and then call themselves Catholic. Which do you suppose to be?
I gather from your accusatory
I gather from your accusatory tone that the part about him being a Democrat rattled your cage? Indicated to you that he does not meet your lofty standards of orthodoxy? You appear to be so blinded by judgmentalism and self righteousness that you're a very poor example of catholicism yourself -- if indeed that's what you purport to be.
IF being faithful to the
IF being faithful to the teaching of the church is something I choose then it is my right and If others choose to follow thier own deluded version of the churches teachings then I feel sorry for them. I will pray for Fr. Mike because he apparently is not openly faithful to the teachings of the church and he needs prayers to regain the truth in his life.
Peace & good
krm
JMJ+
In terms of the larger
In terms of the larger Catholic population, you aren't outnumbered at all but most internet groups identifying themselves as "Catholic" would be more accurately described as "Republicans who happen to be Catholic" - not Catholic in any "universal" sense but more in common with Red State or Free Republic. As far as the KofC, you might as well join CPAC.
You certainly are not alone,
You certainly are not alone, Father!!!!!
at long last, a man who gives
at long last, a man who gives utterance to the catholic spirit of the social encyclicals without paying homage to the fanatic right--and he's not even the pope....good lord, Obama for president!
Do you understand and read
Do you understand and read the Gospel of Jesus Christ, if you do I am surprized you can say what you said about Obama, if you don't then you need to read the words of our Lord and Savior...then you will see clearly why he is not on the right track and he does not represent "truth" in God but represents what is truth for him....rationalization....
krm JMJ+
Who put you in the Judgment
Who put you in the Judgment Seat when it comes to what represents truth to Obama or anyone else? You rationalize your own judgmentalism and thinly veiled hatred with false piety (JMJ). Read what Jesus said to the pharisees and think about it.
A great article!!!
A great article!!!
Catholics devoted to only one issue
- including some bishops -
need to read a Catholic view.
I'm confident that Mr. Obama
I'm confident that Mr. Obama will approach the Holy Father with an open mind. He won't come to a pro-life conviction immediately, unless a miracle occurs. But we Catholics do believe in miracles! I pray for both men every day.
It was quite clear to me that
It was quite clear to me that the President is dancing around the issues. He doesn't want to address anything straight on. We cannot accept the killing of the innocent and then turn around and say I want to help the poor and needy. The unborn are the ones in most need and they are being ignored. Stop killing the innocent and then we will feed them and provide for them and love them cause in the words of Hillary " it takes a village to raise a child" and the world is God's village. And a child must be allowed to enter the world before we can provide for them, right.
And just because some Bishops don't stand up for Catholic Teaching doesn't mean they are right, Jesus said, " If you are luke warm I spit you out of my mouth." And He said, " If you are not with me you are against me!" There is no such thing as "common ground" when it comes to LIFE or any other issue that takes away the rights of an individual created by God.
There is too much political correctness and tolerance, you don't hurt me and I won't bother you but we are not out to hurt homosexuals, we just don't want our children adopted by same sex couples or our children taught that a gay livestyle is what God created us to share.
I think the President and his wife need to pray and ask God what He wants from them, not what do the people want from them or what will make the Polls rise or their popularity. Time to do right.....and live by the truth.
Praying for the truth....
Krm jm,j+
Yes I agree. The world
Yes I agree. The world suffers from too much tolerance - especially for those already born and for those lukewarm bishops who don't stand up for "Catholic Teaching" when it comes to voting instructions.
---And He said "If you are
---And He said "If you are not with me you are against me!"---
Actually it was George Bush who said that.
If George Bush said, "If you
If George Bush said, "If you are not with me, your are against me" he got it from the bible, because Jesus Christ said it first. But then again, George Bush is a Christian so he would know good teaching when he hears it.
Kudos George.
krm
When Barack and Benedict XVI
When Barack and Benedict XVI meet July 10 in Rome, they will share a lot of common ground. They have both written books on hope. Obama’s best selling "The Audacity of Hope" (2006) articulates a theme he pounded home throughout the presidential campaign: there is a better America we all yearn for and hope to attain. That means change. The pope’s highly thought of encyclical “In Hope We Were Saved” (2007) recalls the early church and its struggle to survive poverty, persecution and suffering. They hoped for a better future for their children, and of course, a heavenly reward. Audacity states that the politics of hope requires a new society that values fairness, equality, better education, and health care for all. The Pope’s letter reminds his readers that the “blessed life” demands that one be concerned with personal salvation but also asserts the Christian’s responsibility to build up the kingdom here on earth. The city of man will flourish if we cherish freedom and rationality. Obama is optimistic about America’s future because we as a country have shown a dogged determination to overcome our fears and work together for change. There is a better future for those who believe. Benedict recalls the lives of martyrs and saints who in the past did not give up hope but believed that the church would be better through suffering and prayer. In teaching college students I try to show the connection between religion and society: religious leaders and heads of state have similar ideas and they need to dialogue in order solidify relations and make sure they are working together for the community’s well being. It is fascinating to know that the U.S. president can say that our future is bright because we believe in the principles of the founding fathers and that Benedict is hopeful about the future because in the past Christians and Catholics have overcome even greater obstacles than we face today. I am hopeful about their meeting: these men have a lot in common.
Dr. John Kinkel, Oakland University, kinkel@oakland.edu
It concerns me that you put
It concerns me that you put the president on the same plane with the POPE. Obviously the Pope has far more responsibility and experience. After all, the POPE is head of the Church in the whole world, and the president is only president of the USA one of many world leaders.
First of all you are right that they are concerned about the same issues of life for all human beings. But the Pope made it clear that without LIFE there is not need for health care or any other human service. So when the President recognizes the unborn's right to life....then I will pay attention to the goals he has set, until then he is a "clanging cymbal".
God have mercy on the USA for setting an unfit example to the world.
Pray for peace and love for all people, not just the ones some value while forgetting others. The POPE includes all in his goal to care for the world.
JMJ+
When Barack and Benedict XVI
When Barack and Benedict XVI meet July 10 in Rome, they will share a lot of common ground. They have both written books on hope. Obama’s best selling The Audacity of Hope (2006) articulates a theme he pounded home throughout the presidential campaign: there is a better America we all yearn for and hope to attain. That means change. The pope’s highly thought of encyclical “In Hope We Were Saved” (2007) recalls the early church and its struggle to survive poverty, persecution and suffering. They hoped for better future for their children, and of course, a heavenly reward. Audacity states that the politics of hope requires a new society that values fairness, equality, better education, and health care for all. The Pope’s letter reminds his readers that the “blessed life” demands that one be concerned with personal salvation but also asserts the Christian’s responsibility to building up the kingdom here on earth. The city of man will flourish if we cherish freedom and rationality. Obama is optimistic about America’s future because we as a country have shown a dogged determination to overcome our fears and work together for change. There is a better future for those who believe. Benedict recalls the lives of martyrs and saints who in the past did not give up hope but believed that the church would be better through suffering and prayer. In teaching college students I try to show the connection between religion and society: religious leaders and heads of state have similar ideas and they need to dialogue in order solidify relations and make sure they are working together for the community’s well being. It is fascinating to know that the U.S. president can say that our future is bright because we believe in the principles of the founding fathers and that Benedict is hopeful about the future because in the past Christians and Catholics have overcome even greater obstacles than we face today. I am hopeful about the meeting; these men have a lot in common.
Dr. John Kinkel, Oakland University, Mich
Judge not lest you be judged,
Judge not lest you be judged, what does that mean....anyone can break the commandments of God and no one should step in and guide them? Don't correct children when they do wrong to others? Let the law enforcement step back and allow all hell to break loose? The supreme court judges but we can't? Exactly how do you apply that line from scripture?
The killing of millions of innocent babies is ok, don't judge those who defent it, make it law, and carry it out at all costs?
That sounds rediculous to me....anyone else find it hard to swallow.
Jesus called those out who were doing wrong and asked them to repent and change that sinful behavior......it didn't say do it until it seems wrong to you....or it's none of my business.
So I am making it my business to protect the unborn, and to ask of those who support it to think about what they are doing and to pray for insight and then act on it. I am not judging the person I am judging the action of the person and that is not the same, Love the sinner....NOT THE SIN!
respectfully prolife,
krm JMJ+19
Dear krm, Is a miscarriage a
Dear krm,
Is a miscarriage a sin? Some Bishops have had difficulty understanding that a D&C for an miscarriage or and inevitable abortion is good medical care and once was defined as such in my Catholic medical school. When a blastocyst fails to implant in a Uterus, who is the sinner? I think that there is a real problem when people such as yourself sit in judgment an have little understanding of the observation of science. Tell me how and when do YOU define abortion, ensoulment, personhood? The Bishops have a real problem with these issues and are in trouble trying to make these issue way too concrete.
So lets calm down a little and try to discern more of what the issues really are! Because in trying to be a savior, it is possible that some are just making the situation worse. Certainly that is the problem with our more vociferous leadership.
Peace and more understanding,
R. Dennis Porch, MD
Dear Freind, I assure you
Dear Freind,
I assure you when it comes to church teaching we must stick with the truth and only the truth. The truth be told, conception begins at the moment of conception and that is when we suppose God places the soul in the person to be. Unfortunately sometimes health does not permit the baby to grow and develope properly in the womb and as a result there is such a thing called "Spontaneous Abortion". But this is not murder. The body can't help the baby remain and form so the body takes care of itself and the little one, soul and body return to God from whence he or she came.
But when a child is in the womb and he or she is sucked out by a machine or poisened with acid or turn and pulled from the womb feet first and has a pair of scissors stabbed into the baby's head so that the brains can be sucked out while they are alive and then the head is crushed and the baby is delivered dead....then I guess you would be forced to say that this is not spontaneous abortion something that happens in all of nature.
When man says it is ok to kill a little one in the womb then it is just a matter of time until someone will decide if he gets to live ....be very careful we are on the dawn of such thinking at this very moment. Not my child or my grandchild or my mother or father....not if I can help it. Maybe even me if it continues for opposition to LIfe seems to be a "crime" in today's government. Or at least we have been called "terrorists". Not the ones who fly planes into buildings.... but those who carry signs to defend helpless human beings created by God for God.
Think on this and then ask God to open your heart to the truth....you will come around.
I will pray for you to see things through God's eyes....
Peace and Good,
krm
Dear KRM, There is a problem
Dear KRM,
There is a problem when anyone believes that they know THE TRUTH. The Holy Spirit was given us, all of us, until the end of time so that we may become aware of more truth. That said I would agree with what you said about abortion. I have never recommended or participated in a medical abortion. It would make me sick to do so, but my reference to blastocysts, a multi cellular structure much like a seed that forms after the one cell zygote stage, has nothing to do with a fetus being sucked from a uterus. Blastocysts are tiny structures the enter a Uterus in which over 50 % closer to 70% are never able to implant in a normal healthy woman not using any birth control devices.
Theses are the same structures that scientists are studying in the lab and are improperly referred to as embryos as they have not yet reached that stage of growth and development. So when most of these structures do not implant naturally, it is unlikely that they contain souls or our God would be allowing so very many of his creation to never grow and develop. The Church has never officially defined when ensoulment takes place as it is an impossible definition to make. Some Theologians such as Aquinas and Augustine following the thoughts of Aristotle have postulated a different state of existence prior to development of soul. In fact even some Popes have taught that there is no soul before quickening at about 12 weeks! So Nancy Pelosi was correct, we simply do not know when life, ensoument or personhood begins, but the observations of science make it inconceivable that it begins with fertilization. Since mind has been defined as a subset of soul, it would follow that there must be sensuous systems formed in the brain prior to any chance of early mind. It is interesting that the first sensuous brain system formed is the sense of smell and taste at about 12 weeks. This would seem to me to be the most conservative point that we could even postulate existence of a soul.
As far as miscarriages and spontaneous abortions go, they were always defined very well by clerics when I was in medical school in the 1960’s and 70’s, but as of recent there have been some bishops and priests recommending to women not to have a medically necessary D&C when spontaneous abortions (miscarriages) are occurring. This is a serious medical decision and has nothing to do with abortion as the baby is aborting or spontaneous abortion is eminent. When uninformed clerics interfere with medical decisions for these women who are in the unfortunate position of in most cases loosing something very precious to them, these men are not counseling from charity but in ignorance. It is happening all too frequently because of the poor definitions that Bishops are giving to the word abortion. In fact they sometimes refer to some bithcontrol methods as causing abortions and this is never, yes NEVER TRUE because they are not casing the interruption of a fetus that has implanted in a uterus. So I suggest that these clerics pay close attention to the field of embryology that is making the observations of just what is occurring and I further suggest that these individuals quit trying to make infallible, expansive judgments trying to over define something that the observations of science show not to be true. Have they not learned by there own Copernican errors? Will they continue to misdefine science? They have little to gain and a lot to loose from this approach.
Peace and more understanding,
R. Dennis Porch, MD
Dear Sir, I do respect your
Dear Sir,
I do respect your intellegence and knowledge on the medical matter of abortion, and yes we all have the Holy Spirit in our lives, but if we reject Him and His Wisdom I can't say that I believe, that all know truth. It is a gift from God for those who trust and believe Him completely.
As far as spontaneous abortion is concerned: if it is not a fertilized egg then it is not a person and has no soul. But if fertilized then it is a person and has a soul. I believe that. God gave all men the freedom to choose to follow Him or not so you are free to do so.
I know first hand of many incidents when freinds of mine we told to get a D&C because the child was not viable and would not be born and that it would be a threat to the mother to continue the pregnancy. Well one of my friends has 3 of her 9 children to show for their advice not being 100 percent correct. She was also told her children would be down-syndromed or have some form of severe birth defects...again she choose life and none of what was supposed to happen to the child did. She has 9 healthy children.....ergo I guess God really is in charge if you let Him be.
My sister-in-law was having twins, she herself a twin, she lost one about 5 months into her pregnancy and was advised to have a D&C because the pregnancy was interupted and she would miscarry anyway....she refused and 3 months later she had a little boy.....well I guess there is just 2 examples I know of that proves that the medical community isn't alway right.
My mother conceived 21 times, she had 14 live births , 4 stillborns and 3 miscarriages.....but never had a D&C and at the age of 55 and 80 her Gynecologist said she was in marvelous shape for a woman with so many births....she is 87 and still living idependently and baby sits to this day.
Well I guess my experience has been limited to the divine intervention of God Almighty so if that gives me a slanted view then so be it....I would rather error on the side of LIFE...and in the words of Jesus, "Father forgive them for they know not what they do..." so obviously not everyone knows what "truth is".
I pray for those who don't know what God asks of them... that they will hear His voice in the depths of their beings and turn to Him for Mercy and knowledge.
God help us all if we think we are God ourselves.
krm
Krm, Sorry to be so late to
Krm,
Sorry to be so late to reply. You have not pointed to one case where an abortion was eminent, you have given some opinions about the medical history of some people with out the first hand medical knowledge of examination or diagnoses. However, some of your stories could have some truth. Medical men have made mistakes, some because of lack of belief in soul but others just medical mistakes. Your mom is indeed lucky to have been pregnant so many times without good medical treatment. Onehundredfifty years ago, the life expectancy of men was 42 and women 38. The reason we have increased life expectancy today is mostly because of food distribution and some because of better medical care. The reason that the life expectancy for women was even less than for men was that women frequently bled to death secondary to their uteruses at the time of either child birth or spontaneous abortions. (miscarriages). In fact, I once witnessed as a student a woman with a spontaneous abortion and a placenta accreta both loose her baby and almost loose her life as the anesthesiologist gave her twenty-six units of blood. To think that some clergy today are telling women not to believe their doctors about miscarriages is almost as criminal as covering up sex abuse of a child. This is true even though in this case clergy may not be breaking any law by their latent lust for control that is nothing more than megalomania.
May you have peace and understanding and begin to learn from more humble clergy!
R. Dennis Porch, MD
I am glad that the president
I am glad that the president met with the Pope to discuss moral issues. I do wonder how he tried to justify his position on abortion. I am curious how the president talks of the need to lower the number of abortions while personally saying the procedure is OK. Sounds like double talk. online casino
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