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PDF versionSexual misconduct in church won't disappear
by Bill Tammeus on Nov. 16, 2011
Probably when anyone thinks about clergy sexual misconduct, what first (and maybe only) comes to mind is the priest abuse scandal in the Catholic church.
And, for sure, it has deserved the attention it has received, given the appalling behavior of some members of the clergy and given that most victims have been children, the most vulnerable members of the family of faith.
But the result of this misguided myopia is that faith communities have not paid nearly enough attention to the wider issue of clergy sexual abuse happening with disgusting regularity in Protestant churches and other traditions.
A new book has helped me understand the widespread nature of the problem. And it has offered some ideas for how to deal with it when it happens and, beyond that, how to prevent it.
In Clergy Sexual Misconduct: A Systems Approach to Prevention, Intervention, and Oversight, authors John Thoburn, Rob Baker and Maria Dal Maso note that "nearly 10 percent of Protestant pastors have sexual contact with someone other than a spouse while in the ministry (and) more than 30 percent of ministers engage in sexual behavior that they consider inappropriate ..."
And those troubling figures don't even take into account the "15 percent of ministers (who) qualify as addicted to Internet pornography."
As much as those of us who are Protestant might wish to deny the problem, it's hard to miss. Even my own family was victimized by clergy sexual misconduct in the early 1990s when the married man who was pastor of my congregation had an affair with the woman who then was my wife. So I get this issue.
If other Protestants are honest about reality, they can look much closer to home to find examples of the problem without having to drag up such high-profile cases as those of Jim Bakker, Ted Haggard, Gordon MacDonald or Jimmy Swaggart.
The question, thus, is not whether there's a problem. Clearly there is. The question is what churches are doing about it. The sad answer for Protestants today is similar to the unacceptable answer that eventually surfaced when that question was asked a few years ago among Catholics: not enough.
What first must happen, of course, is that people in the pews and their lay leaders need to be convinced that the problem is real and that they have a responsibility to recognize that and respond in appropriate ways.
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But what really is an appropriate response? Should we hire private investigators to spy on all the pastors? Of course not.
The new book on clergy sexual misconduct suggests something more reasonable and no doubt more effective: understanding what leads pastors toward such misconduct and working to remove or at least mitigate those causes.
The authors say it's important to grasp that humans are complex beings with many forces and stresses at work in their lives. And just as the triune God is in a loving and wholesome relationship with God's own self, so clergy must understand their own internal and external relations and how they influence their behavior and attitudes.
As the authors write: "Ill health is related to damage or brokenness in the ecology of these relationships, resulting in a life that is unbalanced, unfocused, and disintegrated."
As someone who has known many members of the clergy of various faith traditions over many years, I no longer am surprised to find some whose lives are unbalanced, unfocused and disintegrated. The miracle to me is how many members of the clergy live in balanced, well-focused ways with mostly healthy relationships.
But sexual misconduct is a problem that will never disappear. The human sex drive is simply too powerful.
That's why lay leaders in churches must insist on confronting the issue in a systematic way -- just as the Catholic church has had to create new systems for identifying and preventing abuse of children.
Otherwise we're just begging for trouble.
[Bill Tammeus, a Presbyterian elder and former award-winning Faith columnist for The Kansas City Star, writes the daily "Faith Matters" blog for The Star's website and a monthly column for The Presbyterian Outlook. His latest book, co-authored with Rabbi Jacques Cukierkorn, is They Were Just People: Stories of Rescue in Poland During the Holocaust. Email him at wtammeus@kc.rr.com.]
So the clergy abuse scandal
So the clergy abuse scandal is not caused by celibacy and hierarchy and can't be cured by married and/or same-sex clergy? Oh, what will NCR say now?
What logically follows from
What logically follows from this article is that there are sexual problems with protestant clergy some who are married and have illicit sex. What does not logically follow is that celibacy in not at the root cause of pedophile priests in the Catholic church. If you know anything about psychology, you know that the repression of such a powerful drive as sex is going to lead to certain paths. Either that celibate is going to become a holy and celibate person or they are going to find an outlet for that sex drive. Homosexuality and pedophile behavior are some of these sinful outlets. We know that 50% of Catholic priests are sexually active. And 50% plus or minus are holy and celibate or sexually impotent because of age etc. Celibacy is a big problem for 50% of Catholic priests who are sinful at best, unholy at worst. Celibacy is a big problem. Suppression of sex is always a powder keg. The spiritual life seeks to channel that force into a path of holiness. Obviously some priests have opted off the path. They should leave the priesthood. But the Catholic church seeks to keep them as priests at the risk of child abuse, homosexual abuse or whatever other grevious sins humans are capable of, even cases of murder. That is the problem with the Catholic church which I love and am a practicing member. It needs to dismiss bishops and priests that are not on a holy spiritual path. Instead they keep the likes of Cardinal Law and Bishop Murphy and thousands of priests that are moved around instead of being defrocked. Celibacy is the root cause of the problems in the Catholic church. Married clergy will bring its own problems as this article points out.
Most men entering the
Most men entering the seminary today are older and have had relationships with women. They are given intense pychological testing. Once in the seminary, they have six years to discern if they can lead a celibate life.
How do you know that 50 percent of priests are not living a celibate life? Anyone can throw out a percentage with nothing to back it up. A recent survey indicates that young priests are in favor of celibacy. Since 2004, there has been a 20 percent increase of men in seminaries. That statistic can be proved.
Annonymous:"A recent survey
Annonymous:"A recent survey indicates that young priests are in favor of celibacy."
We can be certain, that those young priests are homosexually oriented, and enter the priesthood,so that they do not have to give an explaination to family and friends why they do net get married. The priesthood is a hidding place first and foremost. Living celibate? Hardly!
Martha must not know any
Martha must not know any young seminarians. Today's group is a hardy bunch - they have to be, to put up with the current societal response to someone who wants to live a consecrated religious life.
The ones I know are manly, virtuous and joy-filled. And I even know their ex-girlfriends in a case or two. The young men dated in high school and college and were often able to tell their girlfriends they were discerning their call to marriage or the religious life. In one case, the girlfriend is the one who put the idea of priesthood into the young man's head after they both got involved in pro-life activities in college.
Theresa, are you aware of how
Theresa, are you aware of how many homosexual men have dated women in high school and college? Also, you seem to think that there is a relationship between being "manly" and being holy. I don't know of any link that connects the two.
Yet, what I am willing to guess that what we both desire is a healthy and holy priesthood. So, if that is true, I invite you to join me in my prayers and I will join you in yours.
John David
Therese Z, Just how "hardy"
Therese Z, Just how "hardy" can these seminarians you know be? With their propensity for lace cottas, black birettas,and fiddleback silken chasuables, not to mention other obsessions over other sartorial matters, one has to wonder just how "hardy" these guys really are.
Therese Z, You said, "In one case, the girlfriend is the one who put the idea of priesthood into the young man's head after they both got involved in pro-life activities in college."
That said, it could mean any number of scenarios leading up to his deciding to go into the seminary. One being, the girl may well have given him the royal brush-off because she knew he wasn't interested in her or in other girls. He accepted her idea didn't he?
Too bad he didn't decide to go into an Anglican or Lutheran seminary. He could have had his cake and eat it too. All the more reason to say goodbye to Benny's world of perpetual self-sacrifice and self-loathing through schemes of self-mortification by the innocent and the well adjusted young men and women while either the sexually suppressed or the sociopathologically immature are buried away in seminaries and a world of secrecy and the rule of silence. Not a healthy situation at all.
Yes anonymous, but the fall
Yes anonymous, but the fall out of the "yesterday's" clergy are still living and that 20% you refer to as "celibate", how would you really know.
It's not so much the "spilling of seed", it's taking responsability of what the seed has created, this the church refuses to allow them to do.
The Minister General of the Franciscans knows all about that with individual Australian cases on record which I'm aware of with certitude, I also know diocesan clergy are no better off with certainty, with sisters leaned upon to get them out of their "predicaments".
Some of your points are well
Some of your points are well taken - but only some. It seems you make the common mistake of confusing homosexuality with "abuse" or pedophilia. These are not directly linked. You may regard homosexuality as a sin, but you by doing so discredit all of the knowledge and understanding that has been gathered in over 50 years of research. Someone can be pedophilic regardless of their sexual orientation. I have no idea what you mean in your saying "homosexual abuse..." but again, it is a non-defensible position to hold. Behaviors should not be confused with one's biological orientations.
To underscore my point a bit, I have professional knowledge of Catholic clergy who have sexually abused pre-adolescent children, some boys and some girls, but mostly boys, but were not pedophiles (as objectively measured). The priests involved were both homosexual and heterosexual in their orientations. What prompted them to abuse children was the exercise of power over younger kids, the selection of mostly boys becase it "fits" the all-male structure of the RCC and could be passed-off as "spiritual and vocational guidance," and availability to the priest/abusers. There were considerable psychological issues surrounding their (priests) own immaturity and lack of in-depth relationships with others and an overwhelming need to be the "good boy" they felt their parents wanted. This is distinctly different from those priests and religious who possess the opposite: great faith, a clear sense of themselves and what they want in life, directed to service to others, and a solid sexual identity and knowledge of what they are giving up in terms of sex amd good choices of ways of managing their impulses - sexual and otherwise. This has been wonderfully illustrated in a number of essays written by Dr. Eugene Kennedy at this site.
It seems you make the common
It seems you make the common mistake of treating research by those who have no particular disregard,and perhaps motivations to advocate,for homosexual activity as forbidding organizations from requiring that their members refrain from such activity and be penalized for failure to adhere to the organizations' rules.
Freud has been discredited
Freud has been discredited over and over again. SOrry.
Really Bill, The, well
Really Bill,
The, well someone else did it also defense. Gotta love it
BAD BISHOPS/GOOD KIDS ......
BAD BISHOPS/GOOD KIDS ...... Of course, given the strength of sexual urges and the perpetual perversion of some percentage in every population, we will always have pedophiles, like we will always have some murderers, thieves and liars.
Often, the pedophiles cannot be identified before they commit their crimes so we must do our best to see that victims are comforted and given justice. What we can do as a secular society, however, is to control pedophiles as soon as they are identified.
That is where Catholic bishops and their Roman superiors have failed and continue to fail society. Whether these priest pedophiles were affected by celibacy, homosexuality or just the weather is of lesser importance. Once identified, they must be controlled. It is why everyone, from the Catholic faithful to government prosecutors, must say emphatically to Catholic bishops: "Enough!".
Pedophile priests may not be able to control their sexual urges. Once identified, pedophile priests can, however, be controlled if bishops report them immediately to the police. Yet, bishops continue to refuse to do this.
Many defenseless children, raped by priests, were raped after the local bishop knew with certainty that the pedophile priest was a real danger to children. The bishops who enabled this to happen are at least as guilty as the perverted pedophile priests who commited the rapes.
Instead of addressing this abuse epidemic like reponsible citizens, US bishops have spent over $3 billion on a flawed legal strategy that has mainly protected pedophiles and re-abused victims, while denying many victims basic justice. It has also led to the closing of many parishes and schools. Finally, it has led to a complete loss of trust and credibility among most Catholics for bishops.
The US bishops have just completed their annual meeting and have once again failed to take any real action to address their institutional failure.
Instead, US bishops have spent a great deal of time at their meeting working on election year "value props" designed to elect a "lower taxes on the Catholic 1%" Republican US president next year. In a close election, as expected, this apparently papally mandated election effort could fool enough conservative Catholics to tip the scales, even though Republicans in power do little more then Democrats to promote these values.
Perhaps cynically, it appears that Democrats, knowing the US bishops will not support them, have decided to take on the US bishops on the child sexual abuse issue. They know that the Irish PM, Enda Kenny, has been very favorably received with a more traditional Catholic electorate for standing up to the Vatican over the sexual abuse of Irish children by priests.
We also know that Jesus spoke several times mandating us to protect children, some of whom were likely to have been sexually abused in his time. Typically, Jewish men in his day married and had children. Significantally and surprisingly, the New Testament is silent on whether he had a wife or children. Subsequent traditions arose denying that he had either.
Whether Jesus did or not have a wife and children is not critical on the sexual abuse issue. His apostles certainly had both. Living in a small village, as opposed to a Roman palace, Jesus must have known many children well, so his mandate that we protect them must be taken seriously.
By not demanding more forcefully that US bishops address their continuing failure to protect children from bishops who enable pedophiles to abuse more children, many American Catholics are disobeying Jesus' clear mandate grieviously. It is not too late to remedy this, before the criminal law process remedies this by locking up a substantial number of bishops.
For more on the apparent "post-Penn State scandal", Democratic challenge to the US bishops on the child sexual abuse issue, please note the NCR comment and related cross links under the comment heading, "KC, PENN STATE AND FEDS" , accessible by clicking on at:
http://ncronline.org/news/accountability/lawsuit-alleges-finn-kc-diocese...
"Typically, Jewish men in his
"Typically, Jewish men in his day married and had children. Significantally and surprisingly, the New Testament is silent on whether he had a wife or children. Subsequent traditions arose denying that he had either."
Not to detract at all from your post, but imo the fact that marriage and family were extremely commonplace during the time of Jesus walking this earth suggests to me that he just may have had a wife and family. Many comments were made about Jesus by others, and had he not been married, that would have been quite a unique situation, not to be silenced among his friends, neighbors and community at large.
Your posts are always informative and I enjoy reading them. This one is no exception!
Blimey Jerry, I can never see
Blimey Jerry, I can never see an Australian bishop ever being locked up for what they did or didn't do.
I see them all ducking behind one another ,in turn when the spotlight falls on one or the other.
Humerous when you come to think of it, like a bunch of naughty boy's hiding from their mother.
Pamela, The scandal is not
Pamela,
The scandal is not that the clergy sexual abuse of children happened. The scandal is the fact that Catholic bishops covered it up at the expense of the children who were abused.
The scandal is both the
The scandal is both the actual sexual abuse and the cover up. Its disrespectful to the victims of these crimes to state otherwise.
Although obviously the abuse
Although obviously the abuse is horrific and scandalous, I agree that it is the cover up that is by far the bigger issue. Being victimized by a member of the clergy is a horrendous experience, but being realistic, you cannot totally prevent or ensure against abuse happening anywhere. Shit happens. The issue (at least for me) is that when I turned to my Church to try to prevent this from happening again the response was hardly "Christlike". This was far more damaging than the original abuse. One trusted person turning out to be an abuser is shocking, but when you turn to other trusted people for help and they let you down, that is incredibly destructive. That applies in any similar situation....you lose trust in human nature. In a (catholic) church setting multiply the effect by infinity because the people concerned are supposed to act in the person of Christ.
It was a long time ago and I have forgiven the abuser. He wasn't quite right in the head. I don't know if I will ever find forgiveness for those who failed to help me (and him!) and other potential victims.
Pamela, is it really
Pamela, is it really necessary to be so snarky? I don't know anyone naive enough to think that clergy sexual abuse can be eliminated by having a married clergy, same sex or otherwise. What I AM hearing, however, is that many people take this issue so seriously that they want us all to be willing to consider and talk about
ANYTHING that might possibly have any influence at all on a wholesale attempt to better this serious situation. What don't you like about that? It seems like a good idea to me.
"They strain out the nat yet
"They strain out the nat yet swallow the camel." --Jesus. While the anal-retentive hierarchy attempts to convince us of their holiness by spewing out a regressive liturgical obscenity, they continue to deny and neglect the Holy Spirit's warning in the letter to Timothy which mandates a married clery. Their conciences are seared as if by a red-hot iron which allows them to cover up priestly-homosexual abuses of children. It is to their damnation that the worst evil is in the most sacred of places.
Dear Mr. Tammeus, When we
Dear Mr. Tammeus,
When we lived in KCMO, I loved your columns, so it's neat to meet you again on NCR. This column is terrific. As a Catholic, I've been upset, angry, mortified and more about the pedophilia scandal in my church. It may sound crazy, but in some odd way it is a bit of relief--not a very good word--to know that it goes on in other churches. A Protestant friend told me a bit about this issue some time ago. I can't begin to imagine how you felt when you discover that your former wife was involved in this...
Thanks for sharing another story and another viewpoint.
Bill has hit the nail on the
Bill has hit the nail on the head. The possibility of sexual misconduct is always a risk, in every profession, career, or vocation. The challenge for churches is to deal with it openly, honestly, and charitably. The first step toward that is transparency.
For the love of God, could we
For the love of God, could we try to keep focused.
The Roman Catholic Church has had a problem with sexual abusive clerics from the year 1. In the 1980s and 1990s a few criminal cases of priests sexually exploiting children and young people began to come forward,rape and sodomy for starters, then oral sex and on down the line. Civil suits then followed.
"Sexual misconduct" doesn't begin to cover the horrific nature of Childhood Sexual Abuse- by anyone.
However, bishops were never disciplined or removed from office for enabling and facilitating the abuse of children because they protected, transferred, hid known predators.
Dear Sister Maureen, I can't
Dear Sister Maureen,
I can't speak for certain that the RCC began raping children "from year 1" but anyone who reads a newspaper is aware it's been happening since the 1850's. Pope Benedict began the canonization process of Sister Mac Killop (Patron Saint of the whistle blowers" last October. We will probably never understand the true magnitude (and for the sake of decent Catholics...we are better off not knowing).
Thank you for being the victim's advocate.
Annonymous,NO,no,no, We are
Annonymous,NO,no,no, We are not better off not knowing.
The more bad publicity is given to this terrible crime of child abuse, the less it can occur, because more people are being made aware when it stares in their faces repeatedly, day after day.
Maureen, what a pity your so
Maureen, what a pity your so far away, Judy Courtin Phd law candidate of Monash University, is holding a rally Sunday 4th of December at Parliment House in the city of Melbourne. She is calling for an inquiry into the 36 [and counting] known suicide cases the result of clergy abuse, to be handed over to the coroner for re-investigation. 26 of them alone in the one diocese of Ballarat, country Victoria. The present bishop Peter Connors gone underground stating nothing would be achieved. He at the time of Vicar General, having dozens of cases passing by his office, stating in the obituary of the Archishop of the day that "he was always fearful of hurting priest's, and found it difficult to correct and reprimand them". The Age April 9 2008. No mention of the victims whose lives were destroyed as a result. Or for that matter, children of clergy born in the facility in place by Archbishop Daniel Mannix and utilized for decades until the mid 1980's and in his timeline.
It particularly won't go away
It particularly won't go away so long as apologists and bishops keep falsely claiming that it has gone away.
"nearly 10 percent of
"nearly 10 percent of Protestant pastors have sexual contact with someone other than a spouse while in the ministry (and) more than 30 percent of ministers engage in sexual behavior that they consider inappropriate ..."
And those troubling figures don't even take into account the "15 percent of ministers (who) qualify as addicted to Internet pornography."
Do we have any ideas what the same percentages would be for priests (including bishops, cardinals etc.)? The 10 percent has to include priests who have sexual contact with any person of either sex, of any age. The 30 percent would also include priests who have masterbated. And the 15 percent is self explainatory. I suspect the percentages for priests would exceed those above.
I've read that about 5% of
I've read that about 5% of priests are know to have molested children. SNAP estimates that that is only half the problem, eg its more like 10%
While the general public only less then 1 % of the people are known to be moelsters.
Ireland, with 6 million catholics, about $2 billion has been paid in damages.
In the USA also about 2 billion $$ has also been paid.
While there are certainly other factors, the USA has about 70 million catholics.
this suggests that we may have only scratched the surface of the problem> I know a couple people who know and admit they were molested. A third who is so "out of joint" mentally e,g he said to me that Matthew Shepards parents soudl ahve fixed him. Blaming the parents for the grisly murder. The guy also told me he was schizophrenic, couldnt hold a job etc. My phd psych professor is certain he was molested, he's from boston and would have been an alter boy in the mid 1950s.
BTw he's an "ultra orthodox RC." He's totally devoted to the church, which seems to be his "solution" to his problems. He's per my psych prof a perfect example of also how the church twists the guilt to him.
And then uses him. I know its horrible, but could it be the hierarchy actually benefits knowingly from using their victims.??
If "more than 30 percent of
If "more than 30 percent of ministers engage in sexual behavior that they consider inappropriate," imagine what the real percent is. . .
How about 70 are never
How about 70 are never celibate, 29 percent sometime, and maybe 1 percent all the time.
As I have already stated
As I have already stated somewhere on NCR, it's not so much the spilling of the seed, but the lack of respect for it's life giving force.
Why would there be any concerns by the church irrespective of the claims to the importance of life.
Whether it is Rome or Geneva
Whether it is Rome or Geneva Canterbury or Constantinople or Penn State it is the same old story. As long as we seek to save our life as in the institution we will most assuredly lose it! When I confronted the superior of the order of monks about my own story of abuse I was told that: one. the monk had left the order, married, and was deceased and two that I was living proof of the Grace of God at work since despite the abuse had become a priest! He could not understand my rage at his answer!
Until we prosecute bishops, pastors, rabbis, imams,whatever the title and put the leadership in jail along with the perpetrators we will never even begin to address this crisis and disgrace. We are talking not only about the rape of the body but of the soul! If I, regardless of most Traditions, were to violate the sacnticty of the confessional or even breach confidentiality I would incur automatic excommunication but yet clergy who violate children do not! Jesus weeps!
Certainly most people who
Certainly most people who read this are dismayed at the horror you lived through. Of course those clergy should have to get the same penalties from the courts as the abuser from the secular world. So far they have not.
From my exerience, I am absoutely certain that there is a much higher percentage of abusers in the ranks of our celibate priesthood. And no, I will and can not elaborate.
Thanks for sharing and may you be blessed for it. Because of speaking up, will help prevent more abuse. The more light we shine on it, the less it can occur.
Your second paragraph
Your second paragraph confuses me; you know something, but won't elaborate. Are you the same person who posted this earlier?
The more bad publicity is given to this terrible crime of child abuse, the less it can occur, because more people are being made aware when it stares in their faces repeatedly, day after day.
Dear Mr. Tammeus, I deeply
Dear Mr. Tammeus,
I deeply apreciate your honesty! Sometimes, Catholics waste so much time at throwing stones at other's glass ceilings, forgetting their own glass domes... And I must agree with Sister Maureen: the rape of young boys and girls, and the dilatory strategies used by the hierarchy, beat all the "records": in comparison, "your" problem shows just that human frailty affects people from all religions or without a religion at all.
I would like to add just a small coment, related to the addition to porno sites and other kinds of inapropriate beahviour: we all live in the most eroticezed environment in human history. TV, publicity, as well as the net, are full of sexy messages. There are almost no advertisements that do not use the exposition of naked bodies, beautiful young people or some sort of subliminal sexy appeal. The big corporations exploit that gold mine. And only the very strong ones are able to fight the mind contaminating effects. I'm not trying to justify bad behaviors. I'm only trying to understand.
Of corse, there is no justification for Catholic sex abuse (and, above all, its hiding),nor for the action of the pastor who had a case with your wife. Even an atheist with ethical principles would be able to recognize that.
First, let's make the
First, let's make the distinction between the rape of children by clergy (of whatever ilk) and "sexual misconduct" of mutually consenting adults.
Second, lets make the distinction between sexual deviation by a sick pervert who uses his status as "person of God" and the deliberate, systematic institutional denial, obfuscation, diminution and victim blaming. It is not the perpetrators who castigate and attempt to marginalize the legal system, the media and the "whistle-blowers" it is the hierarchy (I would include the "Swaggerts" and ilk). One uses the "sanctity" of the institution to destroy children, the other sacrifices the children to protect the institution
Third, let's reflect on the magnitude of betrayal that a person dedicated to bring God to God's people and people to God; in a position of unbridled trust in the home, parish, school, community; trained in the theology and ethic of sex's place and especially those who have solemly promised or vowed to sublimate sexuality would exploit, endanger, ruin the lives of children and youth (perpetrator and moreso pastor, bishop,etc). Let the adults look after themselves.
I completely agree. My
I completely agree. My thought throughout my reading of this was that the exploitation of children is so different from fornication. I would add that pedophiles are not a Catholic invention. They have been part of humanity forever, probably. The problem is that they don't belong in positions of trust, which means they don't belong in the priesthood. If they are found there, the Church has to do something to undo their ordination, not just put them in places where they cannot do harm. Their very presence in the organization taints everything the organization supposedly does on behalf of God.
Your right about fornication
Your right about fornication being so different from the exploitation of children of sex abuse Marie, but where is the voice for children "born of fornication", the world is full of them, and not all clergy who are father's go off and fornicate for lust or just being human, with any woman being the vehicle.
A now deceased Australian Fransican friar, through due process at Canon Law, requested a rescript of his vows for the mother and child she bore because he wanted to have a family of his own, being the sensitive and loving person that he was.
Instead of granting his request made with the full support of his wonderful Minister Provincial, which was still being sort on his deathbed, [and never recinded I may add], it was refused "due to the evident cause for scandal and inheritance rights". Never mind the the child being left with the church's and the faithful who consider the "fornication factor" over the rights of a father and his child.
No doubt this is the reason the childs name was removed from the Baptism Register; just as well they couldn't change the Birth and Death Certificates, much to the chargrin of the now Bishop of Ballarat Peters Connors.
You are correct, which is why
You are correct, which is why child protection was put in the Bible. The passage from Jesus about leading the little ones astray had nothing to do with orthodoxy, it was all about pederastry and was likely already occurring in the Church when the Gospels were set down (at the time, there was no doctrine).
Tammeus is right that 'sexual
Tammeus is right that 'sexual misconduct' will not disappear, however, the conditions which make it less likely and which make its detection and mitigation immeasurably better can be identified. There is no single solution. Some of these might include:
1.R-e-a-l participation by the community/parish in the identification and selection of candidates for priesthood. But not that token, ritualistic presentation of the already-annointed followed by applause and a donation for a gift that I have seen.
2.There is a term, which I cannot recall, for the community to identify candidates for priesthood based upon their demonstrated maturity, intelligence, credibility, wisdom and goodness- regardless of sex and/or marital status. The learning can follow.
3.Freedom for priests to marry and for married men to be ordained.
4.Women admitted to the priesthood
5.Accountability to the community in the selection, and retention of bishops as well as clergy
6."Absolute" requirement for reporting reasonable presumption of sexual abuse of children and other vulnerable to police.
7. Relearning, exploring and instilling the "anam cara" notion of spiritual guidance in the life-long development of clergy.
8. Reversing the institutional priority from "traditional markers" and "command and control" to the meaning and conduct of love. The church "as expert in humanity" should possess, demonstrate and share the profound meaning of human love. That is the basis of and starting point for understanding and responding to the person and message of Christ -in the church and in the world. That would be the new beginning of the culture of human as well as religious maturation - not just of clergy, but of us all. The measure of well-ordered love is the measure of the hierarchy, the clergy, and each of us.
1.R-e-a-l participation by
1.R-e-a-l participation by the community/parish in the identification and selection of candidates for priesthood. But not that token, ritualistic presentation of the already-annointed followed by applause and a donation for a gift that I have seen.
=========================================================================
Dennism, LOL LOL I've been to plenty of those. Like the folkes in the pews were consulted and the shouting of " He is worthy, he is worthy" comes from the bishop and archdeacon before anyone can raise so much as a word of opposition.
In the case of episcopal ordinations, this grand farce is even more outlandish. We see the ever-present ghost of Caesar working through the bishop of Rome. Pontifex Maximus Benedictus in his apostolic mandate has decreed his choice long before the cries of "Axios, Axios" begin to ring out.
These pro forma shams suggesting the presence of a democratic process at work in the Church are cruelty jokes. Even more cruel considering who sneaks through the cracks into the priesthood without a thorough vetting by people and clergy.
The Church needs to demand real power given to royal priesthood of the laity.
Even the comment "real power
Even the comment "real power to the priesthood of the laity" is scary.
The situation is so bad that the word "priest" must make millions of parents etc tremble.
The hiding of the abuse scandal is the last straw. It adds to the almost death of the church in eg w. Europe etc.
And maybe thats God's plan to protect children
Even the comment "real power
Even the comment "real power to the priesthood of the laity" is scary.
The situation is so bad that the word "priest" must make millions of parents etc tremble.
The hiding of the abuse scandal is the last straw. It adds to the almost death of the church in eg w. Europe etc.
And maybe thats God's plan to protect children
Bill Tammeus is a genius.
Bill Tammeus is a genius.
There are countless crimes
There are countless crimes and perverse acts committed every single day by human beings of diverse ages. I find it interesting that so many here seem to take great pleasure at tut tutting the horrible things done by some priest and bishops. I agree that offenses like these should never happen, but we are dealing with the human condition which is never far removed from sins and misdeeds of every kind. Do you think there's a way to easily identify those who are going to engage in heinous acts? Far and away most crimes against children are committed by trusted family members, teachers, scoutmasters, coaches, and counselors. Where is the outré against families, schools, scouting, athletics, etc? I propose that as truly awful as the offenses of priests and bishops have been, there is no real interest in getting to the root and branch of the most fundamental factors involved here. We humans often want to do things that are wrong and immoral as long as nobody sees us or exposes us. We Americans, in particular, tolerate, even celebrate the sexual saturation of the popular culture. Sexual acts have long since been reduced to private recreational behavior indulged in for pleasure. This is not a simple issue in whichG we just wag our heads as we condemn the church out of hand for the sins of its worst members. I find that scandalous.
Hi Bill, Loved this article.
Hi Bill, Loved this article. Still your ever-faithful fan.
Even though this article discusses a dark subject, the fact that you threw light on the Protestant dark side and A GREAT NEW RESOURCE book...a Systems Approach to Prevention...makes your article feel soap-scrubbed clean.
Hey Bill and fellow Commenters: How about if we all, in these NCR comments, discuss: PREVENTION, INTERVENTION, OVERSIGHT (See referenced in article above, book title).
Let's apply our talents to practical solutions. And Bill, for those of us who truly don't have funds (to buy the book) in these OCCUPY times: PLEASE. PLEASE. Write a second article delineating these above SOLUTION approaches.
Folks, let's stop debating. Enough already. There has been SEXUAL ASSAULT (the correct term) on these kids/adults. NOT PRETTY!
Let's roll up our sleeves and DEAL WITH IT! Please Bill, article #2. Let's dig deep. Brains, Catholics, brains.
'Manly' men can be
'Manly' men can be homosexuals too. Priests, football players, actors, construction workers etc, can look 'manly', robust, full of muscles, with deep voices and no 'feminine' mannerisms, and still be homosexuals.
So Therese Z, you can not tell a book by its 'cover' sometimes.
So much heat and so little
So much heat and so little warmth! Something gets missed is the pitch and toss of words and such. I would like to speak for the process of priest formation and its unintended result in prolonging, sometimes interminably,
the reaching of adulthood.
Seminarians are taught to obey and not to question authority. This works
for the seminary and creates a sense of all is well and harmony. Underneath
all this there are yearnings in the seminarians. Not the kind you might be
thinking of, sorry. These are yearnings for getting out of formation and into reality. Totally understandable.
REALITY?
A young man leaves the seminary, ordained and ready for the good works. So he gets an assignment. If he is lucky he will have a Parish priest as his supervisor who has been honed by experience and is a real gem. These are
few and far between. More likely he will have to cope with a mean spirited control freak who will treat him like a ten year old. Big problem. When
human growth is stunted many pretty awful things can result. WE all know
about alcohol. However there are other ways of trying to establish some control in your life and they can be through aberrant behaviour. This is not
an excuse for the consequences, I simply want to point out that simply
improving formation is no cure. The real problems come after formation and
very few of us are up to living day to day with a demanding and controlling
'parent'. Normally even with normal parents we all come to a time when moving out becomes natural. Clergy in far too many cases are trapped. They
live with the fact that the PP has access to the bishop and can make or break
your future. It is important to understand that the power seekers get the
satisfaction and the promotions. They know instinctively how to game the system and they are happy with their lot. What about the rest? The argument
is a lot less about celibacy/marriage than you might think. Priests in religious orders have a much better chance of staying whole than the lonely
prospects faced by ssecular priests. Yes, there will be aberrations in either
case. However, I am amazed at how many times Regular clergy are involved when
they are serving in secular parishes. Everyone is correct to point out that
child abuse is an equal opportunity employer. It matters not in one sense what
creed, what state regular/secular, what sex male/female an offender happens
to fit in. This is why the problem for us catholics turns, not on the actual
offender but on the Hierarchical Cover Up. That is the problem which has to
be faced openly and honestly. Now, just how to get all these mini absolute monarchs to agree on anything is just about impossible. I thought Bishop Finn
would turn out to be a crack in the wall. Then a kind but not bright lawman
gives the Bishop an out none of us would get in similar circumstances. There
are still those who give breaks to clergy. This is not how to fix the worst
part of the problem.
Deus in adjutorium nostrum intende!
TomC
Bill, No sexual misconduct in
Bill,
No sexual misconduct in our church will never disappear.
But it MUST be kept to a minimum. The pedophilia must be nearly extinguished. As soon as a pedophiler is discovered the reports must go out to the police immediately. Then and only then, should the bishop be notified, if at all. And then, only with police permission. Because the police may want to do an undercover 'sting operation', either on the internet and/or then by personal surveillance.
BTW---
This new latest crop of very, very angry priests seems very suspect. Is their hate filled rhetoric because they have lost their 'chicken coop' full of vulnerable victims. At any rate they seem vicious and very dangerous.
If that is because they are fundamentalist Catholics inspired by the pope and Karl Rove/Frank Luntz/GOP then that is yet another reason to consider them to be very dangerous. One is led to ask: just exactly how have they been schooled at seminary. Why as new priests are they so very angry, already? Exactly what were they taught???
If they are as they seem, that is all the more reason for concern for America, it's people and the people and nations of the entire world!!! They are dangerous in the extreme, not unlike that Altar boy Timothy McVeigh, and all of the other hate groups associated with the Republican party. The party filled to brimming, with government haters, people haters and the other over 900 hate groups and militias. Should the pope want them to get further hate government and the American people training he can send them to Idaho or most states throughout the South. They can very easily look up organizations that they can join to learn hate ideology and the methodology they employ to attack others. That would round out their seminary training. Then they can espouse their hatred for everyone even as they are now just beginning to do on these NCR pages.
Sad to say. Especially, given that Christs' core teachings were all about peace, love, tolerance and " Do unto others...
It's something we'll all be watching for.
I hold both the bishops and
I hold both the bishops and the priests responsible for this mess, but I would also add anyone who knew, or suspected, child abuse and did not report it to the police, including those who reported it to a principal, another priest, or a bishop. The solution to this problem is not changing the priesthood but changing how people respond to the abuse. The immediate, knee jerk response should always be to report anything you suspect to the police. And if you knew and did not report, you go to jail also.
Iam searching for a priest
Iam searching for a priest name Rev. Daniel Corbett from Buffalo N.Y. He was ordain by the Pope in 1966.He came to Puerto Rico to learn Sanish.He left because he was from The papal volunteers.I dont know where he is now.I would like to know about him. If by any chance you can find his address.Please e-mail me to cuqui3@yahoo.com or at my phone number tha is 787-410-8962. Thank you very much. Carmen Torres
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