Newsflash to Dolan: Catholics lead on gay equality

Statistically, Catholics also favor war, nuclear arms, capital punishment, divorce, and a whole host of other social questionables. When are you going to understand that the Church is not called to follow trends, but to defend truth? To do that, the Church should listen to a bona fide sensus fidelium, but no theologian ever equated the sensus fidelium with poll results. Abp. Dolan understands that. You, quite obviously, do not.

By standing up for the rights of homosexuals, he, among others ought to catch up with Richard Sipe and beg for forgiveness for the way homosexuals within 'establishment' have been treated, having to sleek away into the night dying of aids.
With past 'hotlines' connected to the Vatican, one wonders how some of these prelates have the gaul to make any public statements.
Me thinks, he and others doth protest too much.

The topic of homosexuality has been an intriguing one in Catholic circles. Obviously most of the theological community has realized through scholarly advances in biblical theology and psychology that the former prohibitions against homosexual love and sexuality need to be reassessed. The Catholic community is aware of the goodness of their gay and lesbian friends and family members, and wants their loved ones treated with dignity and given equality. And the public and Christian community is intrigued by the rants against gays and their lifestyle by the members of the hierarchy, many of whom are gay themselves. We see it as a fascinating exercise of self-loathing and hate. You can't even make this stuff up!!!

I'm gay and I think that the idea of gay marriage reflects soft-headed thinking on all fronts: soft-headed anthropological thinking, soft-headed political-constitutional thinking, soft-headed aesthetic thinking, soft-headed emotional thinking, soft-headed philosophical thinking, soft-headed theological thinking. I think a person has to absolutize a bourgeois "Ozzie and Harriet" version of reality to declare an ersatz right such as gay marriage to be an elemental, foundational right of any sort.

He is right you know. It is a slippery slop. You can see it now in the polygamist community. Their argument is that if you change your traditional interpretation of marriage to something else, why not change it for us, and it goes on and on from there. It really goes on. I can in-vision a few years down the line when Mrs. Manson will be fighting for the rights of Incest Marriage and Pet Marriage.

Oedipus wept.

Some have long suspected an oedipal aspect to the celibate clergy, noting a very unusual closeness to mother among many priests.

Now this emerges most clearly in Dolan's Freudian slip . . .

Jamie - This is a fabulous essay. Just fabulous. Jean

Compare this purposeful lack of clarity with the hollow thunder of yet another Dolanite statement reported here yesterday:

“We remain especially firm in our commitment to remove permanently from public ministry any priest who committed such an intolerable offense,” Dolan said.

What intolerable offense? The hierarchy has tolerated the offense for centuries, like war.

Only priests (as a commenter noted under the relevant article)?
Not those with episcopal ordination, not, for instance, heads of the USCCB?

How firm? How will we know? Rather dangling thus far . . .
Oh, wait. "Especially firm." Well, isn't that special . . .

So, private ministry is ok? What, like to the crusader Catholics at Blackwater?

And why are great and heroic priests such as the Reverend Father Miguel D'Escoto MM and the Reverend Father Ernesto Cardenal so quickly and easily removed from all ministry, public and private, when the marielite Wojtyla found their bringing Good News to the Poor not passing his firmly right wing political litmus test? Is it worse to serve the poor than to commit this intolerable offense?

What degree of proof is required to find a priest has to Dolan's firm satisfaction actually and truly and really committed this intolerable offense and is thus eligible for his firmly permanent and public removal?

Dude.
Just asking, you know?

Amazingly Dolan did not indulge himself with the jest of priests marrying their victims, permanently, having found the horribly incestuous so to his bizarre and self-revelatory taste.

Has this become a shameful Catholic cultural marker in anglo America?
Used to be Irish (a pride) and Alcoholic (not), but this?

I just received junk mail from co-workers who apparently HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO on a Friday afternoon than send junk e-mail, and I had nothing better to do than to read what turned out to be a long series of very brief letters to the famous and the infamous. Here are two, both so totally spurious and scurrilous:

"Dear Fox News,
So far, no news about foxes.
Sincerely,
Unimpressed

Dear Michael Jackson,
You really should have become a Catholic Priest. The pay isn't great,
but the benefits....
Sincerely, The Pope"

Hey, the man wants to be a cardinal and then Pope! I don't care what he said (My lady doth protest too much!), he can't get access to the fancy duds without parroting all of the correct bromides at the correct times.

As a Catholic, I felt no urge to cringe and was not embarassed in any way by his comments. They were right on target. There is no room for negotiation. Same sex unions may be called just that, unions, but never a marriage. The polls can point to whatever direction, it does not mean the Church will rewrite Dogma or the Canons to satisfy whatever flavor of the month is on the agenda. Love and rerverence is one thing, being forced or expected to change views opinions and teachings, not to mention Canon is another.

A little more research on this "survey" you cite surveyed 3,000 people, which included 600 Catholics. THAT is what you feel shows the opinion of a majority of Catholics overall as a groupp? 600? I could interview 600 people in San Francisco and come back with a stat showing more that 85% of Americans approve Gay "marriage". Doesn't mean that is America's overall opinion.

Here is a link from where I got my info:
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/news/info-missing-from-survey-claiming...

I still wonder why our pastors insist on confusing civil marriage contracts with the Sacrament of Matrimony. The Church does not recognize civil marriage or decrees of divorce which can be granted for many reasons or no reason at all. The Sacrament of Matrimony is a covenant that cannot be broken. It can only be annuled if entered into invalidly. The state recognizes the Sacrament of Matrimony as a valid contract if it is properly registered, but it makes no comment about its spirituality.
Our pastors would better serve us if they spent more time and energy helping us understand our human sexuality as a gift from God to be treasured and safeguarded. Help us learn more about the marriage covenant and to give it equal status with Holy Orders as a sacrament of service to the community. Help us to develop a mature Christian understanding of same-sex unions. Help us to accept each other as images of God who have been reconciled with our Father in, with and through our Brother and Lord Jesus and now strive to follow the guidance of the Holy Spirit who guides our feet into the way of peace.

It should be illuminating to find out what position and pro sport pop into Dolan's mind when he ponders heterosexual marriage (non-incestual variety). His reference to encoding suggests it may be more complicated than most have thought.

I dont think the Church would be required to Marry a Gay Couple, but they need to keep their nose out of American Rights and Freedoms. The Seperation of State and Church. Its why America was founded. The Church also supported Slavery at one time, and thankfully Slavery was not put on the Ballot, or it never would of passed.