This is my blood, shed for a few: Phoenix faces living on bread alone

It saddens me to see Marina's post. But I came to understand a long time ago that some of the greatest collaborators in the clerical suppression of women are women. No surprise. The Nazis could not have kept those millions of Jews locked up in death camps without the collaboration of Jewish prisoners.

I believe that bread and wine become the body and blood of Christ when the Holy Spirit descends on a faith community remembering the death of Jesus until he comes. As a priest, I speak for and with the community. I cannot believe in the "matter-form" explanation of the Eucharist and the priest as the sayer of the magic words. This tries to stuff the mystery of our Eucharistic faith into the sausage grinder of Aristotle, who created the philosophical notion of matter and form. And so we focus on the consecration/elevation and miss the complexity and depth of the mystery.

What violence has "GIRMS" foisted upon you? I see no evidence in your writings. Please go and educate yourself of the "GIRMS" and not become like those who just use a pen to write.

Religion in and of itself is not violent. It is people who become violent; either people are attacked when they try to spread their beliefs of those who object to such a belief. People regardless of whether they are Christians or otherwise will defend themselves when they are under attack. Do you expect otherwise?

If Christians did not defend itself from the Moors/Muslims in the early part of History (Crusades etc.) we would not have enjoyed the beauty of Christianity today. And it was the Catholic Church who for most part was responsible for the viability and success of the Christian faith.

"You cannot teach your grandmother (Catholic Church) how to suck an egg." The problem is that too many of her children/grand children no longer treasure the beauties and history of the Church.

I agree that the Church has erred and needs cleansing. but to place an agenda to destroy, maime and hurt members of the Church because of a disagreement is dishonest and nasty. Sts. Ignatius, padre Pio to name a few understood what is means to be catholic. Even under persecution they stood with the Church knowing that a greater good (God) will bring out the truth.

"Stand Together for what you believe
Work for what must be done
love each other in all that we do
And give glory to God."

Unfortunately, a number of persons are giving up on the Church and by extention on God because of (oftentimes) articles published by feminists, gay-right activists (priests and nuns)former disgruntled members (theologians)with agendas bashing Church teachings and perpetrating hatred towards authority. Some of these people have been highly educated by us the laity and have now become the biggest detractors of the Church. They have become the authority on Church teachings pushing their own agendas and ideology through mediums as NCR.

The Church will never fail! The Church is Jesus Christ, and our faith is built upon him. Yes, we are weak, but he is strong. He has selected weak men and women to bring the goodnews to the poor, to bring liberty and freeedom to those who are oppressed, widowed and orphaned and to all who are enslaved by the media.

throughout the ages he has chosen murderers(Moses,Saul) adulteror (s) David to lead his people and also reveal the personhood of Jesus (the second person of the Trinity)through the lineage of these sinful men.

Trust, Love and Pray for your Bishops and priests and religious that they will remain faithful to their vows. For those who have fallen we ask God to give them the grace to recognise their failings and return HOME!

when followed faithfully, yes it can, and it can ONLY be nonviolent!
see for example In the Spirit of St. Francis and the Sultan: Catholics and Muslims Working Together for the Common Good by RC Deacon George Dardess

but also read Beyond Religion by the Dalai Lama ...

I believe in Vatican II! What clarity it brought to the Church:
"Bishops who teach in communion with the Roman Pontiff are to be respected by all as witnesses of divine and catholic truth; the faithful, for their part, should concur with the bishops judgments, made in the name of Christ in matters of faith and morals, and adhere to it with a religious docility of spirit." Lumen Gentium 25.

It will be the last straw for those who cannot eat wheat. The shortsighted bishop is effectively "excommunicating" people who may only drink from the cup that has never been touched by wheat. Very insensitive of him, but, sadly, not surprising.

Susanfo

Again we must start educate ourselves on the teachings of the Church. It is the duty of the Bishop to ensure that the sacraments are not abused. But unfortunately, "they're damned if the do and damned if the don't".

Unfortunately, we are educated by people within the Church who are portraying their own "agenda". They don't have the courage to declare this and still continue to use the name and title "catholic".

If the Church was to institute the strictest way in which the Eucharist is to be received etc. we would be alarmed. Some of us as catholics have been abusing the reception of Holy Communion for far too long. For example:

1. Receiving communion with chewing-gums/sweet in the mouth.
2. Receiving in the hand and cupping the precious Body in our mouth.
3. Dress code in coming forward for communion. (the priests have more clothing on their body than the average laity and yet we see how some of us go up for the reception of Holy Communion. And the listing of abuses can go on

The next time you go to Church make a prayerful observation. The Bishop is the chief shepherd for the Church and therefore we should support him with our prayers.

The most unfortunate thing that is happening to the Church and the world is that we are no longer being educated by the Church but by the liberal media of which some of our fellow catholics who have an axe to grind use to manipulate the minds of our people.

People are upset with the sex scandals and we use their emotion in a dishonest way to attack the Church and to continue to show the negatives within the Church. Some of these people also helped to create the "wrongs" within the church and as usual as they do to hide behind the "habit/clerical gown" or now "NCR" to spew vengeance.

This newspaper need to have a balanced view on what is written by each author. Some of the authors/writers see only the wrong and never anything good within the Church and also have the audacity of using the title "Sister, Nun, Priest or catholic."

"God calls us to be faithful, not successful." If is when we are faithful that we can become successful.

"To those who have faith, no explanation is necessary
To those who have no faith, no eplanation is possible."

This is the doctrine and truth of our faith! The Bishop (s) are the ones elected as the successors of the Apostles to pass on this faith.

Thanks to Jesus! I guess he knew that all ansundry will come and try to re-interpret his message.

That is why I AM CATHOLIC

Well said! THE issue of course is control by the hierarchy of the "sheeple" through the clergy. It's not a healthy situation, even before factoring in the clerical abuse, coverups, and acute lack of candor. Very sad.

On a related note, Bishop Olmsted is behaving like a third world despot who shortstops donated food from the starving and converts it to his own use. He provides great incentive to avoid travel to Phoenix over a Sunday or holy day.

Yes,   and God is always generous too.     Nowhere in the gospels do we meet a stingy Jesus who did no more than he absolutely had to do.     In fact it was his generosity in feeding and healing that scandalized the legalistic religious leaders who wanted to nitpick law and quibble over ritual purity.     Their retort to the Lord of the universe was   "but our law says..."   and those words are echoed in the words of RCC bishops like Olmsted.
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When Jesus fed the multitudes he didn't sort the people by class/caste and parse food accordingly.     When he multiplied loaves and fishes there was even food left over,   so great was his generosity.     This Lord whose Body and Blood we receive in communion,   himself touched those who were designated as ritually unclean/profane by religious leaders of his day and he healed them with that touch.     Olmsted would have us believe that this same Lord is now pristine,   airbrushed,   untouchable and exclusive because   "their law"   says so.
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When I read of Olmsted comments and comments of some responders to this article referring to the "experiment" of laity receiving the Precious Blood from the communion cup,   it brings tears to my eyes...   and I believe that Jesus also weeps.     Do they even realize the implications of what they say in the use of that word to defend a stingy bishop and his wrongheaded exclusive theology?     The God-man who touched lepers and allowed a hemorrhaging woman to touch him,   would surely not view a layperson's touch to be profane,   or a desire to receive the sacramental Lord in his Eucharistic fullness as an "experiment".     One would surmise that Olmsted and his apologists worship a god they believe to be very small,   petty   and impotent.
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Dr. Dale!

Your opening statement is so way off and clearly shows the contempt and lack of knowledge of what the "Eucharist" represents for us Catholics (not cafeteria ones) when you wrote.

"Jamie, I'm sure that you get tired, as I do, of the same excuse used that Christ is fully present in the host... So What!!!

So What!!! If you are a pysician and someone says he keeps calling himself/herself a physician but has no clue of his/her profession and should be barred from being thrust upon the public would that be ok if someone says he is a good man and the other persons say.. So what!!!

"He may be fully present in both." If this is what you believe that "he maybe." Then at last the Bishop is doing what he is put there to do and preserve the dignity of the Eucharist from persons such as yourself who clearly doesn't understand the "Eucharist."

I hope whatever you have your doctorate in that you maybe a little more respectful to your other colleagues in this respect. We can be educated above our intelligence.

Thank God that the Bishop is not as careless as you are in your statement. This is an insult to doctorate!

It is the home (family) that comes to offer their sacrifices of themselves to God each time they come to Church. The problem is that bad eucharist is often practised at home and becomes the sinfulness of the Church.

For example: There are so many weddings being performed today but hardly any marriages. We do not understand that good marriages begins at home. The way we behave and how we live and at home should help us to understand who we are. It is then we approach the Church to sacramentalise our actions if it is acceptable or to help us to deal with issues before to ensure that we don't abuse the sacrament of love. marriage!

If thieves could make laws burglary would never be an offence.

We have a right to send back the basket empty of money if we believe that our sinful lives separates us from God. Instead, we can place our sinful lives in the offertory basket and offer that to God. that would be a much sincere and honest gift. You clearly do not understand the purpose of your collection.

We want a church that caters to our needs and wants without Christ and his teachings.get real! You either love e or hate me! You cannot have two masters. You either Love one (Christ) or hate the other (sin, greed, selfishness, jealousy etc.).

We keep on using the old tired story about the peadopiles within the Church (which by the way we have helped to nurture and create in the name of freedom. A new poll was done and it stated that 65% of American catholics have no problem with same-sex marriage).

Peadopiles are not born in the Church, they are created and bred often in the homes and families. "What we choose-changes us." With the type of freedom that we so desire comes responsibility and oftentimes we leave this responsibility on the Church. Maybe this is the time that the Lord is allowing us to open our eyes and start taking back our families from the brink of destruction.

Every other soap opera or comedy is portraying same-sex marriage and nasty behaviour in family life. Do we become outrage at this? Jersey shore/Modern family/Glee/Big Bang Theory etc. Well let me inform you. This is what the Churches will look like in a few more years filled with what we want.

This is the type of behaviour in the 60's that have led to this within the Church. The Church will not be saved from this if we don't take actions now within the familes by promoting good family values. This is affecting every profession in the world. the churches leaders comes from the Family.

Do you not see that it is the Media who is now educating the people and not the Church. Money is now the god running America. I was speaking to an African priest recently who told me that in some countries it is conscience that rules the nation, but here in American as in most affluent nations it is the law that is important. So if you can break the law then you seem to be the most successful.

Churches (especially the Catholic church)are kept silent because of lawsuits-and therefore wrong (so called freedom)becomes right and Truth becomes offensive and invasion of ones privacy. "We are now reaping what we have sown for years. Let us deal with it and allow goodness to come out of all this.

Without altar rails,how can one claim to have a "sanctuary"?

It is out of great love for the people of God that is causing the Bishop in protecting his faithful.

Sin is abounding! Hardly anyone goes to confession! The communion lines are longer!

Are we taking the sacraments for granted. Do we not understand the teachings on the Church's doctrine and its efficacy on the faithful.

St. Paul says "If we eat and drink the Body and Blood of the Lord unworthily we bring condemnation on ourselves."

Thank the Bishop for opening our eyes. Now that he has done this let us look deep within ourselves and see what the Lord is saying to us at this time.

You are right! the Eucharist should be and is the Love of Christ poured out for us. but we must receive it with the right attitude. An attitude of love and respect is what we need to bring to the Lord and that starts within the family and how we live out our daily life.

This is true love..that they'll know we are Christians by our love for ourselves and each other and to the Beloved One.

Thanks Bishop!

anyway in this hemisphere our host must not be european wheaten but our own corn tortilla, broken off and passed on.

God bless Father Larry Rosebaugh, OMI

I am also gluten intolerant, and fear that the same may happen in my diocese.

Distributing Communion is not a "right" by any reasonable definition.

Of course you haven't.

"Stick to the facts and educate with and on the truth."

Perhaps you should follow your own advice, huh? Otherwise, oh wise one, educate us regarding your statement: "You have a right to educate yourself before you go making such mischievous statements (If not dishonest)."

Which statement(s) is dishonest? Demonstrate for us the "lack of respect and appreciation" in her article. Please enlighten us! It is one thing to write your comments, it is another to substantiate it! :)

Cheers,

jah mike on Sep. 29, 2011.

You stated:

"You clearly should educate yourself on the sacraments of the Church and its meaning to one's spiritually. The references you make about the "precious blood" shows a lack of respect and appreciation.

Also, you should know that if you receive one you receive all (body and blood). You have a right to educate yourself before you go making such mischievous statements (If not dishonest).

You are not an expert on Church Teachings and you should respect the judgements of the Bishop.

Have you ever been to Church and see how some Catholics receive Holy Communion? and also have you heard the views express by some catholics on why they do not receive the precious blood?

I suppose you want to rite an article with O'Brien with the headline saying "Catholic were poisoned from cup after drinking wine." What a wonderful headline for suing the Church.

Stick to the facts and educate with and on the truth."
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If Jesus had wanted us to receive the Eucharist under one species---Jesus would have done this. The example of Jesus, as practiced by the Apostles and the early Christian communities in the Apostolic Era---constitutes the "Deposit of Faith". This may not be tampered with by any ecclesiastical authority---not even the pope.

Our church HAS tampered with the Deposit of Faith---on a number of issues(too extensive to detail here).

But this bishop's gooble-de-gook---is not inspired by a desire to preserve a greater respect for the Precious Blood of Christ, or because he possesses a deep empathy for the poor of the world, or because he is concerned about passing germs around among the People of God. It is inspired by his distain for the lowly laity, and his deep desire to emphasize the exulted (in his mind) position of the ordained clergy.

Sadly, this bishop (and the rector of the Cathedral) maintains a horrific and arrogant attitude toward the people of Phoenix. Please read the on-line copy of "America" magazine (October 10, 2011) issue. This deals with the Rector of the Cathedral in Phoenix (St. Jude) explanation of why he is forbidding girls to be servers at the altar. He did not discuss this decision with his pastoral council---because "they are untrained in theology". It never occured to him---that there could be trained people in theology on the pastoral council. And even if there were NO people trained in theology---they probably are people who possess the wisdom of life and an expertise in various professions. Their ideas and opinions are worth listening to by any priest who is serious about being a servant-leader.

Finally, you are chiding Jamie for not being an expert on Church Teachings (I know that she has a better background than you do). But you apparently don't know the difference between the meanings of the words "right", "write", and "rite" (since you surmissed that she may want to 'rite' an article....)

Mike, Jamie certainly has "ever been to church;" in fact please see her bio here!

Thank God she sticks to the Truth!

How about the Biblical truth that Jesus excluded no one when he had a meal -- not even Judas at the last supper. If priests stand in the place of Jesus, then they should act like Jesus, and not exclude anyone from receiving communion -- in both types -- as He himself gave them to us. There is far more respect in following the commandments of Jesus than the misguided interpretations of the Council of Trent. A quick multiple choice test: Who is the head of the Church? a. the pope b. the Patriarch of Constantinople C. the Archbishop of Canterbury D. Jesus Christ -- and if you get that right, a lot of the problems of faith take care of themselves.3R

Yeah, Jesus, we don't need your cup. Why are you offering that?

You can see how ridiculous Olmstead's argument that denying the laity to drink the wine out of concern is. Use logic. It would be just as easy to profane the Bread by placing it on your tongue then chewing and spitting It out. To assume that the entire laity must be denied the Cup as commanded by Christ, because of a concern that some nutcase will profane the Eucharist is a poor excuse to again separate Clerics from lowly laity.

This commentator has it correct. When special circumstances arise then they can be addressed and rectified. This is a good solution. WIth all the objections on this topic it is clear to anyone that the People of God, which I am one, have gotten deeply confused as to their roles in the Church. Everyone wants it their way and with no backrounds in Theology, Doctrine, Liturgy etc. they think they know what is best for the whole Church based on their own subjective tastes. People of God, you have forgotten what it is to be humbled. If the Bishop feels this is correct ways should be sought in one's soul to support him. The Church and People of God are tearing each other apart ever since the misguided attempt to turn over control of everything to the people. Imagine having a few thousand Presidents in the White House, each with a different agenda. No organization can stand this type of confusion. Truly if the Church says that fullness can be found in receiving under one kind that should be enough for all of us. Stop ripping the Clergy to shreds as you are only tearing at other Catholics, your neighbors who may disagree with you. How horrible for us all. God help us.

Silly Jesus, He was only kidding when he commanded to eat AND drink... UNLESS you eat AND drink....you will have no life within you.
I'm glad (not) that you are able to set Christ straight with his errant statements about drinking from the cup.

"As far as the "symbol" of receiving both species as at the Last Supper- we are not protestant."

I'm sorry, but I just howled with this one. Perhaps you should let Bishop Olmstead in on this insight so he too, doesn't look 'protestant' when he receives under both forms.

Dear Mary,
Unless you are a victim of Bishop Olmstead, and yes, I chose that word most deliberately, you have no room to speak. He is far from a wonderful bishop. In fact, I would say his consistent lack of respect for his "flock" speaks volumes. He did not even consult with the priests of this diocese prior to having one of his minions make the announcement to the priests of the diocese, as he sat there. In my view, he does not deserve the respect of his office. He is a petty tyrannical bully.
As an extra-ordinary minister of the Eucharist for over 10 years, I can honestly say I have never seen any lay person treat the Eucharist, body or blood with anything except the utmost respect. We know what a privilege it is to serve! Unfortunately, this is more than I can say for some of the ordained I have seen on the altar.
All I can do is plead with people everywhere to pray for us in the diocese of Phoenix as we fight to maintain our Catholic identity. Faith is not the issue, spiritual nourishment is!

Mary F on Sep. 29, 2011.

You stated:

"Bishop Olmstead is a wonderful bishop and is absolutely correct in he approach to his duties and responsibilities as bishop.

Yes Ms. Mason, it is very possible for "a heart that truly desires to drink from the cup or offer the cup to the community really ever profane Christ’s blood?" just as it is possible and very easy for Christ's body, blood soul and divinity to be profaned by communion in the hand.

Yes, there is also the mundane issue of germs. Why no outcry a couple of years ago when flu fears caused many bishops to state there would not be any communion from the cup? Regarding fewer people storming the altar- this is not kindergarten. Everyone does not need to take a turn for church to be "fair". We are there to worship God and we need to move away from liturgy focusing on we the community and back to worshiping God.

Jesus is present body, blood, soul and divinity in the host, period. We don't get "more Jesus" by also receiving from the chalice. As far as the "symbol" of receiving both species as at the Last Supper- we are not protestant.

There will be no issue for those who cannot eat wheat. I know of two young women who attend a church that never offers the chalice and they are gluten intolerant. The church has a small chalice for their use and they go up at the end of the communion line and receive from their chalice. The norms don't prevent necessary exceptions and provide times when communion can be offered under both species."
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If Jesus was afraid of His body and blood being profaned---He would not have offered it the way he did. Look at his example---that is all any bishop should see. People took communion in their hands and drank from a common cup for centuries before the official Church decided to "change what Jesus did" because it wasn't regal enough.

The official Church (after Constantine)wanted the lowly laity to realize that their 'betters' were up at the altar. So they concocted all types of liturgical rule, told the people in the West (largely uneducated, recently converted "barbarians {Goths, Saxons, Britons, Western and Northern Slavs and a few Tartars}, that the people's place was outside the Communion rail. Only the 'consecrated priests' could enter the sacred space. This was perpetuated for centuries.

Bishop Olmsted is far from imitating Christ's generosity and love of his people. He does not convey the life-giving promise of the Good News---he doesn't model it. He is a fearful and fear-driven man.

We do not give worship to God in private. It is WE the Community who come to the Lord's table, Mary. And the people need to participate as much as possible. God does not NEED our worship. But WE NEED the Eucharist---that is why Jesus gave himself so freely to us.

Perhaps there's an up side to this. If less people share drinking from the chalice, there will be less spreading of germs. That means that less people will end up in Catholic hospitals where Bishop Olmsted will have to make some very dire medical decisions.

So What!
You're confusing apples and oranges. Yes Jesus is fully present in each BUT Jesus commanded to eat AND drink. Take this ALL OF YOU and drink from it... that was a command.

By removing the cup, the command of Christ to eat AND drink is being eclipsed.

Your statement: "this is not a new rule, nor is it Bishop Olmsted's personal choice. The permission to distribute Holy Communion under both species was an experiment, the permission for which expired in 2005." is not quite correct.

For the first 1,200 years, the laity received the holy Eucharist under both species. It was only after some plagues hit Europe that the Eucharist by consecrated hosts only was initiated, and only in the West. The Eastern rites, Orthodox, and Oriental churches continue to the present to require the laity to receive both species, although in the form that does not separate the two species. So allowing the laity in the Roman Catholic Church to receive communion under both species is not a experiment, but was the requirement for the first 1200 or so years. I don't think the early Christians, and that includes those at the Last Supper, thought their way of receiving Christ in the Eucharist was an experiment.

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Jerry, who decided whether the experiment worked? Obviously it was judged not have worked because there is no provision for it in the new GIRM. I have to agree with Jamie. I think it was judged not to have worked, because it worked too well. The issue has nothing to do with whether Jesus is fully present in both forms or either form of the Eucharist. The issue is enhancing the divide between mere laity and ordained clergy.

Jerry, You stated: Each species (the consecrated bread and the consecrated wine) is the COMPLETE Body and Blood, Soul add Divinity, of our Lord Jesus Christ. We do not receive any less of Jesus when we receive one species than when we receive both.

Being that this is true, what is the rationale for the priest to receive under both species but not the laity? Why is it a mandate for the ordained priest but not for the laity who are baptized into the priesthood of Christ? Becuase one receives from the fullness of Christ in only the consecrated bread or wine, let's limit the priest also to just the one!

"we do not draw attention to the host or the wine per se, lest they become objects of idolatry". That is one of the most unsettling and bizzare statements I've ever heard from an (allegedly) Catholic extraordinary minister. I take it you've never attended Benediction or Exposition of the Blessed Sacrament? I think you'd find plenty of your so-called "idolatry" there. You cannot be idolatrous in the worship of the true God, in the Person of Christ literally present in the consecrated host. Protestant nonsense at it's worst.

"withholding the precious blood because of one's OWN PREFERENCE or BELIEF is tantamount to heresy in my book" - So Holy Church and all her clergy where heretics from Late Antiquity until the 1960s? Right. I have never in my life (I'm 23) received the Precious Blood and have no desire to do so.

If this is the practice of your Parish Church, i.e not drawing attention to the Body and Precious Blood themselves, then THAT IS heresy and if it were up to me I would petition your local Bishop or Archbishop for a Canonical Visitation of your Church to root out these foul and disgusting protestant doctrines.