Ryan & Dolan: The Letters

Funny how nobody mentions cutting defense.
Security-Industrial complex. Over 600 overseas bases. Ike warned us.
Obama's 2012 budget (including debt service) is $1.2 trilion for security/defense.

Good Lord, Michael, the man just wrote him a letter! That letter, as you say, did nothing more than acknowledge Rep. Ryan's stated intent and inform him that the Conference would be watching the results. That leaves the door of communication open, while letting the Committees do their jobs. It's uncommonly naive of you to think he either shouldn't have written the letter or should have lectured the man on the intricacies of Catholic social thought. By the way, your understanding of Ayn Rand seems as shallow as your opinion of Dolan's letter.

I get nervous when I hear politicians invoking scripture or religion to justify policies. Quite often, they are using scripture as a cover for something that is very self serving and not true. The Bishops need to be very careful when playing footsie with politicians of either party. The Bishops should advocate certain moral principles, but refrain from becoming cheerleaders for politicians of either party.

The USCCB should not engage in apologetics for the GOP anymore than it should be engaged in apologetics for the DEMs. Although of late it seems to be very interested in not upsetting the GOP and very little concerned about upsetting the DEMs. If the Catholic Church in America becomes an arm of the GOP, it truly diminishes the Church of Christ, in my view, as the Church of Christ must search for the path that frees us from our own political tyranny, not engage in the tyranny. One of the great gifts that Christ brought into the world is freedom of Spirit through Love and redemption, not through political machinations, and thus gives us the power to be a true alternative to the world of politics and war, which is the general state of the unredeemed world.

I strongly suspect that Dolan and the USCCB are formulating their goals after direction from the Vatican. I suspect that this letter from Dolan to Ryan may have been approved by the Vatican. It was no accident. Probably prearranged. I worked in politics for many years.
Don't forget that Dolan got his job at the last minute in unusual circumstances. A real power move.
The Vatican wants to have its law as the law of the land in the US. It wants to be the moral authority for our country.
It is becoming more and more evident that Vatican controls of the Bishops world wide are becoming tighter and tighter.
I wonder which politician will be the first target for denial of communion or excommunication. Probably a woman.
Someone will be the example.
And remember , we have not seen the consequences of the "visitation" to the nuns who supported the health care bill against the opinion of the Bishops. I bet the Rome is super furious about that act of non-deference.
Remember Bishop Morris of Australia and his punishment for even mentioning women as clergy or married priests.
PS The Catholic Church's charities to the poor are largely supported by government, national and local. The RC clergy has a real financial interest in "the poor".
It would also be a bonus for the church if the middle class becomes less powerful and more dependent on the RCC.
IMHO the Catholic Church thru it's clergy is too involved in our legislative and electoral affairs.

I'm confused: you recently cheered a priest cutting an ad attacking a political position, but you suddenly take umbrage from Dolan's letter, asserting it is being construed as giving Ryan "policial cover". Again, your instinct is simply partisan: you see no problem with the former (because it comports with your political persuasion), yet object to the latter. COnfusing. What the letter DOES do is give the lie that the only way of fulfilling Matthew 25 or Catholic Social Teaching is through liberal welfare programs. Dolan's letter is the FIRST such letter to portray an understanding of the serious crossroads we as a nation have arrived at with respect to welfare programs.

I don't suspect the Bishops will get much more traction on this than they did on health care reform. The article does have some intersting digs and Randian Catholics, however.

The Church and employers could replace most of the social service state, but doing so would be the end of capitalism and would require giving up the imperial papacy.

The headline on the Politico article is blatantly false. It sounds like Dolan gave a full-throated endorsement of Ryan's plan. Disgusting.

"Shallow Understanding of Ayn Rand"

How could anyone's understanding of Ayn Rand be anything but shallow? Her "philosphy" is as shallow as that of a pouting 9-year-old brat. She was a raving lunatic and a sociopath who is only recognized as a "serious" writer because she was anti-communist and kissed up to rich plutocrats.

The bishops running the Catholic Church are too hypocritical to determine whether Randian Catholics comply with the gospel-based social justice doctrines. As long as the wealthy Randian Catholics oppose abortion, their Ayn Rand ideology will not be publicly opposed the bishops, who depend on contributions from them to live as princes.

Oh come on! You know it has been decreed___a tiny elephant embroidered into the lining of every liturgical stole since November 2008. A much larger one graces the episcopal vestments. You can find them there. If not just check published texts since then for the clear political endorsements.

Dolan tried to thread the needle, giving Ryan what he wanted while keeping deniability with his tightly worded letter. What he got may be the worst of both worlds: Catholics who wonder why Dolan would be enthusiastically supporting gutting Medicare and Medicaid and only a lukewarm endorsement for Ryan.

The Ryan letter is a masterpiece. He describes the dire national fate that awaits without his plan: riots and violence, most citizens living on redistributions, a sprawling network of big government programs that sap human dignity and debt without end. He then sugar-coats the bitter realities of his plan and weasel-words his way through the high earner tax reduction issue.

Ryan truly seems to believe that he is the only person who can save the country and that his plan is the only possible solution. It is anything but. It “saves” Medicare by transferring an artificially low Medicare budget to private insurers with seniors responsible for any shortfall. Medicaid is worse, transferring an artificially low amount to the States and leaving coverage up to them.

For his part, Dolan’s going to have to stop being too cute by half and let Catholics know exactly where he stands.

Mr Ryan's letter is truly jaw-dropping and full of political double-speak. He claims that the "explosive government debt" is "propelled by uncontrolled spending." The main reasons for the debt are the Bush tax cuts, which were extended for 2 years-and that are to be extended permenantly in this budget plan-,two wars, which I pray will soon be wound down totally,the unfunded Medicare drug plan, and the recession. These are the facts. The GOP unfortunately has signed Grover Norquist's pledge to never raise taxes-witness the vote against removing billions of dollars in subsidies to oil companies whose profits in one quarter rival entire year profits in the past. There is no revenue increase in the plan, and in fact there are cuts in taxes to the very, very wealthy. He cites circumstances in several European nations, as happening in all of Europe-which is not true. The United States is not Europe,and this is a false equivalence. Who is "unraveling the safety net?" This budget certainly does that, as do the actions of GOP governors and legislators in many states. The idea that they are "saving Medicare" is a lie. If you take away the guaranteed coverage provided to seniors, you are destroying Medicare, not saving it. And using "block grants" to fund Medicaid will leave many of the poor and elderly out on the streets as the states will not be able to provide for all.

The cost cutting in this budget is coming at the expense of the poor and vulnerable, and no matter how Mr Ryan tries to spin it, this budget plan is not the way forward if we want to consider our nation to be the moral and upright people we claim to be. I do not even want to get into Archbishop Dolan's response-Michael's comment pretty well says it all.

Peace and Blessings.

It is difficult to comment in a christian way. This is simply outrageous.
1. This was set up in advance. Ryan would never have sent his letter unless it was already agreed he would get a supportive response.
2. Ryan's budget is rooted in either monumental ignorance or bad faith. It relies on the proverbial voodoo economics -- lower taxes and increase revenue. This has consistently been proven false. Cuts are imposed only on the poor. No defense cuts. No limit on unjust wars. Eliminate the social safety net for the most vulnerable. There is nothing remotely close to any concept of christianity in any component of what Ryan proposes.
3. By providing 2 pages of complimentary comments, with not the slightest hint of criticism, Dolan has endorsed Ryan and his budget. And he has done that as the Chair of the USNCCB and the Archbishop of NY. There were 2 and only 2 responses that would not amount to an endorsement: (1) a blistering critique of the budget proposal that christianity demands; or (2) a 3 sentence respoonse: received your letter; I will take no position on what you say at this time; good bye.
4. This confirms the total abandonment by Dolan and much of the hierarchy of principles of christian social justice. Sure, they send letters now and then. But they don't push those; don't get them on the front pages; don't spend the big lobbying $$$$ -- except for the abortion issue. Not pro life, because murder, assination, war is fine with your bishops.
5. I trust that Dolan, living in his multi-million dollar mansion in NY, being ferried about in his limousine, with his every need and want taken care of by the hard-earned dollars of others, is enjoying drinking his fine whiskey with teh movers and shakers of NY's and DC's upper crust and politicos.

Ho hum, Michael Sean Winters wants to tell bishops what they can and can't do and who to write and what to write. Isn't that called pontificating?

Wake up! Ayn Rand and Blessed John Paul II THE GREAT! Do you really need any more evidence about Ryan's leanings? You are not great when you blatantly ignore allegations of sexual abuse against a deceitful donor and many others!

Further confirmation of that JFK quote about NUNS and BISHOPS!

"Over 600 overseas bases. Ike warned us."

Sure, there might be some fat in the defense budget, but where does the 600 overseas bases figure come from? Does anybody know where the 600 "bases" are and how big they are?

That's "...by whoever suggested he write"

Whoever is subject of the verb write. The entire clause is object of the preposition 'by', but the case of the relative pronoun is determined by its use in its own clause.

Whether or not Dolan is a fun guy to be around - he has behaved in a way that is entirely contrary to Catholic social teaching and, more importantly, Jesus' explicit instructions on how to deal with the poor. Even if he did not actually endorse Ryan's budget -- he did provide cover for the GOP by praising their (Ryan's) efforts and the Republican strategy. What a horribly embarrassing day for the Church! This is what it has come to!

The Church's track record on supporting the disadvanated has always been one of its greatest virtues.

Regarding Ayn Rand -- her other admirers of course are people like Alan Greenspan and Farrah Fawcett. I've read Ayn Rand -- her message is entirely contrary to the Gospel message. Simply put: One cannot be a follower of Christ and Ayn Rand. The two are mutually exclusive.

I echo the commenter above. Whether or not Dolan is a "fun guy," his letter could not be more telling of his character. Michael, I think you are correct, this IS about Milwaukee. As a someone from the Milwaukee Archdiocese, I know too well of Dolan's tendency to (forgive the expression) schmooze. In the mid '90's, Dolan's predecessor in Milwaukee took to task CEO's of corporations who were moving their industry to Mexico and overseas to take advantage of environmental disregulation and a cheaper labor force(you remember Briggs and Stratton and the like?). Well, when Dolan became archbishop of Milwaukee he was put in charge of cooling those efforts and refocusing on "other issues" (an anti-abortion and more conservative agenda). Of course, those CEO's who had previously been called to task became Dolan's buddies, and, you'd better believe it, strong contributors. SO, this letter is not surprising to me. Perhaps what is surprising is that Ryan took advantage of the opportunity to use the letter as an endorsement without Dolan's consent. SO, is Dolan...fun? Yes, probably. Invested in the Common Good? Nope.