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PDF versionBeatification of John Paul II leaves many Catholics cold
by Eugene Cullen Kennedy on Jan. 27, 2011
COLUMN
By their nature, metaphors allow us “to make journeys,” “to go beyond” a point that we could not otherwise pass.
Metaphors enrich us by their connotations -- the rich allusions and meanings that they deliver as a cloud of witnesses to a broadened and deepened truth about a person or an event.
One of the most common metaphors applied to the soon-to-be-beatified Pope John Paul II tells us more than the hagiographic musings of such apologists as George Weigel, who, as a biographer with books to sell, has a conflict of interest as big as a redwood in his eye.
The late pope -- whose heroic stands as a cardinal archbishop against Polish Communism undoubtedly changed history by pulling the bricks out of the crumbling universe of the Soviet Union -- has been lionized as the coolest of cold warriors.
The metaphor that spontaneously arose to describe him as a pope, however, is “rock star.” Stand back as, like rock fans everywhere, John Paul II’s followers stampede for tickets to his beatification ceremony.
“Rock star” is also applied to former President Bill Clinton and to others who, by their demanding charismatic style, suck all the air out of any room or space that they enter. “Rock stars” need neither an introduction nor an opening act to prepare the audience for their appearance.
They are, however, a lot of work. You have to pay so much undivided attention to them while they are on stage that you may feel your own reserves of energy being drained away as you are called upon to fill and to re-fill the swimming pool-size tanks of the “rock stars’” own need.
What is that need exactly? It isn’t for you as a person, but for them as personalities that run on unquestioned loyalty and unconditional love. “Rock stars” gleam attractively, giving their audiences the equivalent of a double cheeseburger with fries on the side. But it won’t last for take-out; they have to eat it there.
Was John Paul II acclaimed as a “rock star” by accident or did it express the sensus fidelium, the natural judgment of believers, about this pope who stood so tall as he smiled so enigmatically at the crowds that stretched to the horizon about him?
The metaphor suggests other questions. If John Paul knew how to make himself -- or part of himself -- present to a crowd, how much of himself did he ever really reveal to anybody? How well did you know the real man, Karol Wojtyla?
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Are there unanswered questions about this pope who may have dazzled but seemed to exude so little real warmth for the believers at whom, above his Slavic smile, he never seemed to look directly?
What was the inner man -- for this must be the testing point for the blessed -- like when, claiming to be a champion for personalism, he preached of human personality as divided rather than united? What was he like when, in his romantic but self-contained reflections on human sexuality, he spoke so abstractly but with such certainty that abstaining from sex was the highest ideal even for married couples?
Who was this man who sang the glories of the Blessed Mother but who kept real women beyond the end of his wagging finger and was determined, as if the fate of the world depended on it, to keep them out of the priesthood? Who was this man who always defended Paul VI’s Humanae Vitae, but who absented himself from the final vote of the Vatican II commission that recommended a broadening of the church’s position on birth control?
Who was this man who looked away from the burgeoning sex abuse scandal of his clergy while he sheltered and defended the godfather of all sex abusers, Fr. Marcial Maciel Degollado? Who was he when he welcomed Cardinal Law to a Roman sinecure after Law was forced to resign from the archbishopric of Boston for his manner of dealing with sex abusing priests?
There is no doubt that John Paul II was a great man, but he leaves too great a void of coolness about his personality to hurry his beatification. He probably ranks with such other great world saving figures of the 20th century as Franklin D. Roosevelt and Winston Churchill, each of whom was a “rock star” in his own time.
The personality of each, as is true of many great men, bore a rich inlay of narcissism, marked by a self-absorption and need for constant adulation that exhausted everyone around them, including their families.
Perhaps Pope John Paul II leaves many cold because the elements of narcissism within his own personality telegraph themselves invisibly to others.
Should this keep him from being beatified? Probably not, but perhaps it should prompt second thoughts about fast tracking his canonization.
Pope Benedict might ponder his predecessor’s enormous self-absorption, his actor’s sense of timing and his arranging that nobody ever stood next to him when the picture was taken, and wonder why, great or not, he still leaves many Catholics cold.
Narcissists shine brightly but cast a cold shadow. Perhaps that is why so many believers ruefully conclude, “Johnny, we hardly knew ye.”
[Eugene Cullen Kennedy is emeritus professor of psychology at Loyola University, Chicago.]
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Dr. Kennedy hits the nail on
Dr. Kennedy hits the nail on the head perfectly. His essay should be required reading in every seminary in North America where JP2 worship is reaching a fever pitch.
What about John XXIII?!!!
What about John XXIII?!!!
Yes, what about Pope John
Yes, what about Pope John XXIII?
He brought the Church into the 20th and the 2ist centuries.
His light still shines in all the papal darkness of recent years.
ABSOLUTELY! PACEM IN TERRIS
ABSOLUTELY! PACEM IN TERRIS must be required reading in EVERY seminary, too!
Indeed: what about our Papa
Indeed: what about our Papa John???
My many Polish friends indeed have reasons to claim their countryman as blessed, but Pope John XXIII demonstrated true heroic virtue, both under the Nazi horrors of World War II and in his work to open the Church to Africa and our other missions in the world through the Council, despite opposition on all fronts from his more conservative brethren.
(I'd also like to draw attention to how conservative columnist George Weigel twists the times and actions of our late 'Brother Joe', Cardinal Bernadin of Chicago. see http://www.firstthings.com/article/2011/01/the-end-of-the-bernardin-era He's another one whose contributions to Mother Church demonstrated true heroic virtue worthy of sainthood.)
Exactly!!! JP2 was cool (in
Exactly!!! JP2 was cool (in Poland) but no saint. It is abhorrent to think of anyone else being canonized before John XXIII, who was the truest saint and spiritual leader, inspiring in every way.
Hey, they've even skipped
Hey, they've even skipped Pius XII. And to show the politics of the whole business, it wasn't for lack of any so-called sanctity, but because of his very bad politics of ignoring the German atrocities against the Jews during the Hitler era. Pius probably "worked" many more miracles than JP II, but it just wouldn't be politically correct to bring up his name for "blessedness." As for John XXIII, yeah, what about John XXIII? Know what that's all about? John Paul II and Benedict hold Good Pope John and his Second Vatican Council in utter contempt. The strongest force of their "reigns" has been to undo Vatican II as much as they possibly can. For one thing, you'll never get the sensible People of God to return to the ignorance of the foreign language of Latin in their rituals. Never!
After reading so much about
After reading so much about how Pius XII responded to the Jews in WWII era, I googled Pius XII + Holocaust, and the first item to pop up was the first Prime Minister of the State of Israel, Golda Meier, declaring the Pope a 'righteous Gentile' for his assistance to the Jews during this time.
As to the final sentence, I wouuld refer you to the excellent column, Twenty-Something Catholics: The lost generation? by Jamie L. Manson, this edition. The new liturgy contains language that is very convoluted. Young people will not be attracted to it, and if they desire to go to church will undoubtedly choose one where they don't need to strain to understand the language, or that the language makes sense. Of course good sermons and music are vital, but who determines 'good'. I suppose someone with PhD in Gregorian Chant finds the usual hymns sung not 'good'. But the people in the pews sing them, at least in our parish, with great gusto. And they stay for the final verse!!
When the message of Jesus is presented as the map for living a more spiritual and meaningul life to all people, young and old, rather than the rules, regulations and anathemas that the hierarchy seems to prefer, our Church will be vital. In all of those parishes where this has taken place, there is vitality.
That will work if by
That will work if by "message" you meant the gospel, not that for the Jews, that is magnified in Catholic masses-- taken from the gospels of Matt.Mark,Luke and John-- but the gospel of "your salvation" (Eph. 1:13.)
It will never "work" the traditional Catholic way, because that is not Christ's way.
Yes, what about sainthood for
Yes, what about sainthood for John XXIII? If a pope ever deserved a fasttrack to sainthood, it is "Good Pope John."
That is precisely what I ask
That is precisely what I ask myself many times. Why is there never a mention of John XXIII? Why is there a withdrawal from the actions of Vatican II? That was the Pope who should be beatified.that is if I ever believed in such a process. That is a rite proper for the Middle Ages. What miraculous cures?
Pope John Paul II withdrew his hand wahen Priest Poet of the Thirs World Ernesto Cardenal bent down to kiss it. Cardenal was a true Christian.Read his Gospel of Solentiname. Thank you for the space.
John Allen today (2/1/11)has
John Allen today (2/1/11)has a post setting out five possible reasons for "fast-tracking" sainthood. It's a good exposition, especially because these 5 can easily and realistically be reduced to two in our day: the power & influence of money AND the power & influence of those who happen to be kings-of-the-hill. It simply doesn't matter what you & I think who happen to be at the bottom of the heap, money- and power-wise.
They even
They even (Ratzinger/Benedict) moved John XXIII out of his crypt below the basillica and put JPII there with white marble, special lighting, etc. John XXIII is now buried in the floor of the basillica, very hard to locate and pray at since people walk all over his tomb. The symbolism is striking.
How sad! Who knew they moved
How sad! Who knew they moved J23 in obscurity and spotlighted JP2--only those who have the opportunity to travel to Rome.
Thank you OHthor for the info.
Correction: may have been
Correction: may have been mistaken: it may be that there is only a mosaic dedicated to John XXIII on the outer floor of the Basillica, and that he is buried in one of the altars in the Basillica itself. I'll check this out further.....
Indeed. We don't hear much
Indeed. We don't hear much about Good Pope John anymore. I get the feeling that he is something of an embarrassment to the current regime. Too bad when there are so many more worthy candidates for embarrassment.
Isn't it amazing how ignorant
Isn't it amazing how ignorant the typical NCR liberal is? This is the third or fourth article about JPII being beatified where someone has said, "what about John XXIII?" Well, what about him? HE IS ALREADY BEATIFIED!! Try looking at facts for once.
Many of us objected to JPII
Many of us objected to JPII beatifying John XXIII and Pius IX (Pio NoNo) at the same time.
Worship? Fever pitch? A saint
Worship? Fever pitch?
A saint is one who has practiced heroic virtue. It does not mean that she/he was withouut fault, had to know everthing that was knowable and do everything that was doable perfectly. St Paul gave us 1 Cor 13- Love is kind, never rude and on.. But he told those who were forcing circumcision on the Galatians he said I wish the knife had slipped and you castrated yourselves. That made it into the Bible!!! Get a grip all you hyper-critics and see life as it is lived in the real world. Peter denied Jesus on Holy Thursday and in John 21 he was re-established as both Shepherd and Fisher In Chief and served breakfastby the LORD.
Thank you for speaking a bit
Thank you for speaking a bit of common sense in these postings. I'm saddened that so many fellow catholics appear to be making the beatification of JPII into a competition. Can we not celebrate the incredible service this MAN, a fellow human being, in all his imperfections, gave to the Church and the world? I will rejoice and welcome any new saints and also celebrate the many people in my own life I view as saints even though they are not recognized officially.
I did not know Franklin D.
I did not know Franklin D. Roosevelt or Winston Churchill. They were not friends of mine. JP2, you are no Roosevelt or Churchill.
wojtyla left the best of us
wojtyla left the best of us out in the cold
Not only Father Ernesto Cardenal
he was a charlatan, a comedian, an actor
playing-acting Catholic
and playing it badly
he was, hew was...he ain't no
he was, hew was...he ain't no saint
hugh was no saint? I have no
hugh was no saint?
I have no idea who hugh was for you, but the Reverend Father Ernesto Cardenal, student of Merton, is a saint of this hemisphere, as I can personally attest, having met with him on several occassions.
Dear Brother Charles, Where
Dear Brother Charles, Where is the LOVE? Just simple syntax.
Don't people have the right
Don't people have the right to try to control or fashion their image if they choose, or to try to control the public's access to what's inside?
I'm afraid I can't follow you on this one, Dr. K. Frankly, I don't feel curious at all even to know more about the innards of famous extraverts' personalities.
Extreme extraverts do leave me and many others cold. That's something I realized quickly. No revelation there.
Your forgot to mention JPII's
Your forgot to mention JPII's self-flagellation as something really weird about the man.
Quite a normal practice in
Quite a normal practice in Christian asceticism. One seeks counsel and discernment and avoids extremism as in all devotions and practices.
My ex-wife was taught to do
My ex-wife was taught to do self-flagellation in the convent on Saturday nights to atone for the sexual sins being committed at that time. Maybe Ratzinger will return this practice to the re-reformed Catholic Church. Protestants will have trouble accepting the theology for this practice because they believe all the atonement for sin occurred during the crucifiction. Perhaps JPII used it to fight the sin of his own sexual arousal. It could be far better than a cold shower.
Yeah, you're right, because
Yeah, you're right, because self-flagellation seems so horrible. Although, as I think about it, why don't we find it sick when movie stars, in essence, put their bodies through 'flagellation' in order to look right for a particular role? We don't think that it's sick when they do it... why do we find it sick when the Pope does? I guess you would never choose to be a martyr, because if putting your body through pain is bad then choosing death must be horrible.
How is that different than
How is that different than excessive physical training?
I love John Paul II! I love
I love John Paul II! I love his theology around the "acting person". I love his emphasis on the dignity of the human person. I love his implementation of the Second Vatican Council with his writing, the Sources of Renewal, spearheading the new Canon Law compilation and editing, and leading the new version of the Catechism of the Catholic Church, just to name a few reasons why I can love a man you say, "we hardly knew".
we hardly knew because he was
we hardly knew because he was acting, as you say, acting a person of his own papal imagining, rather than doing the hard work of bringing Good News for the poor
we are called not to act but to do, to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, shelter the homeless, free the imprisoned, to heal the sick, to love our enemies.
and to make the poor find some good news.
not to play-act at great expense to local diocese around the world, already strapped with legal costs by his own negligence of abuse
Implementation of the Vatican
Implementation of the Vatican Council? What Kool Aid are you drinking? JP II did everything in his and Ratzinger's power to block the implementation of the promises of the Vatican Council. To name but a few--conscious decisions to neuter the collegiality of bishops' conferences, invocation of a highly questionable concept of "defined doctrine" as an extension of infallibility (If I say it, you will not question it as in the case of the ordination of women),ignoring the Vatican II concepts of religious liberty and the primacy of conscience WITHIN the Church as many scholars and theologians felt the ax of the Papal Rottweiler--Ratzinger. He preached social justice and crushed liberation theologians.
FYI JP II and B16 are known as the leading restorationists, i.e. taking the Church back to the good ole power days of Trent and Vatican I.
How can you praise a man who ignored repeated reports of sexual abuse and sexual misconduct by the founder of the Legionnaires,Fr. Marcial Maciel? as long as Marciel pandered to the papacy and curial officials and endowed them with boatloads of money, he could do whatever he wanted.
I could think of many people I would canonize before JPII--Dorothy Day, Oscar Romero, Cesar Chavez, to name but a few.
The Beatification of John
The Beatification of John Paul
Whatever ones position is on whether or not John Paul II deserves to be beatified or not, one must admit that the selection of May 1, as the date for the service was a stroke of genius.
First there is the possible conflict between the Russians and the Poles. Some of the Russians may still harbor resentment toward John Paul II for his role in the collapse of the iron curtain and the segmentation of the USSR.
These outdated diehards will be in Moscow parading tanks in Red Square. This leaves Saint Peter Square open for the free assemblage of the Poles. They will come in droves.
Next there might possibly be some protests from the Anglicans whose clergy Rome has been poaching of late. But the royal wedding is scheduled for April 29, 2011 and the Archbishop of Canterbury will still be hung over on May 1, 2010 and the very thought of a noisy protest will give him a throbbing headache.
The Voice of the Faithful and SNAP could attempt to launch a protest, but, as a quid quo pro move, Opus Dei in gratuitous/gracious thanks for the canonization of their founder will be hosting a tailgate party before the service. The attending faithful, half drunk with piety and plentiful libations, will make so much noise tossing about footballs and soccer balls and blowing their vuvuzelas there will be no way that VOF of SNAP can start any protest.
The afterglow of the beatification will be handled similarly. Keeping a commitment made by their founder to John Paul II in 1999, the Legion of Christ will be throwing a huge barbeque in Saint Peter Square. About midnight on April 30, 2011 hundreds of mobile barbeque pits will begin their slow cooking. Pork shoulder, beef brisket, ribs of both beasts, cabrito, chicken and polish sausage will begin their journey to the craws of the faithful. Mexican rice, baracho beans, Cole slaw and tortillas will also be prepared but not until later.
During the long winded service, the mobile chuck wagons will line up along the colonnade encircling the square like a wagon train in a John Wayne western prepared to fend off the savages. This time they will be feeding the ravenous faithful who nearly starved to death during the long elaborate lace enthralled service. The meat and side dishes will be consumed and will be washed down with kegs of various brews. There will be Dos XX, St Pauli Girl, Bière Peroni, and pilsners and lagers from all over Europe. There will be an effluent flowing of wine as well. No cellar will be untapped. The possibility of an organized demonstration will evaporate in an over indulged frenzy of piety.
The only possible problem that may arise is a very recent development. The 1997 letter to the bishops of Ireland has just surfaced. The Vatican is carefully monitoring the level of anger that this might engender. The unspoken fear is that the irate Irish might show up with some of their world famous confetti. If this element were to be thrown into the revelry of the Legion of Christ barbeque, the status of the centuries old paving stones in Saint Peter Square could be up in the air.
As a final note, I have forwarded the information about my bad knee being cured by my recent colonoscopy to Rome. I believe this will be found to be the second miracle and the path to sainthood could follow as soon as the streets are swept.
Brilliant scenario! a good
Brilliant scenario! a good laugh does wonders.
Just 3 points to add:
(1) At the Legionaries' BBQ within their VIP tent, a.k.a. Sacred Enclosure, they must also provide sandwiches made of their remaining stock of $1000 hams.
(2) As a fitting tribute to JPII's pontificate, just roll this May 1st, 2012 beatification ceremony in with his canonization which is already a done deal, and loudly and boldly use the savings as compared to two separate events to help some of the dioceses that are badly strapped for cash because of all the scurilous lawsuits.
(3) With all the beer and wine flowing, some cardinal's nephew is set to make a bundle with the exclusive port-a-john franchise.
On this May Day at least, let
On this May Day at least, let us each and all get out and fulfill the Gospel Mandates of giving the poor good reason to find Good News, by healing the sick, clothing the naked, sheltering the homeless illegal, feeding the hungry, giving water to the thirsty, and loving our enemies, including those who march in Red Square.
Dude, cold war's over. Love one another.
Your listings in the celebration pictured so colorfully and carefully here must remind the half awake reader of the famous execution scene in the so-called Cyclops episode of the world's greatest novel, Ulysses, written by an Irishman, devoid, as far I know, of confetti. Are you joycean?
John, your reply cries out to
John, your reply cries out to be made into a video. What great stuff. Thanks for the word-pictures. I especially resonated with "no cellar will go untapped".
Blah blah blah...I don't like
Blah blah blah...I don't like JP II....blah blah blah....
Get over it already. He's a saint and he always taught the truth.
Anonymous on Jan. 27,
Anonymous on Jan. 27, 2011.
You stated:
"Blah blah blah...I don't like JP II....blah blah blah....
Get over it already. He's a saint and he always taught the truth."
----------------------------------
JP II believed that since God had given him the papacy---he was free to shape the Church as HE believed. We had a Borgia pope (Alexander VI), who believed that 'since God has given us the papacy, let's enjoy it.'
JP II supressed theological discussion, muted academic freedom, re-instated "from the top down" Christology, used Vatican II language to impose a return to Vatican I concepts, imposed a revanchist approach to liturgical translation, imposed a re-clericalization of a church that had already embraced the laity as the People of God in the Church of the people, and his treatment of women was an attempt to reduce them to second-class status.
He is no saint!
Yes he is.
Yes he is.
no, he is not
no, he is not
Will this be the five-minute
Will this be the five-minute argument or the full half-hour??
As I was saying, yes he is....
Anonymous on Jan. 29, 2011.
Anonymous on Jan. 29, 2011.
You stated:
"Yes he is."
---------------------------------
Satan was an angel, too (once).
"What is truth?" a question
"What is truth?"
a question unanswered put to Jesus, according to the record.
You're entitled to your
You're entitled to your opinion as are others.
A wise man once asked, "What
A wise man once asked, "What is truth?"
gil, dude, it was Pontius
gil, dude, it was Pontius Pilate.
Wise?
careful anyway, and with very clean hands . . .
Why the rush to canonize
Why the rush to canonize JPII? Does the right wing need the affirmation that his sainthood would bestow? All canonizations are political, chosen to hightling some practical need. Canonizing Santo Subito the Great will not justify the lack of discernment that Maciel's patron showed. Can you imagine a Benedict or a Francis or an Ignatius so totally lacking in discernment in matters of religious formation? I cannot.
Could this be an important
Could this be an important part of Benedict's attempt to re-Catholocize Europe? As Poland has started to follow others of its European counterparts and become a more diverse society, is this the time the Vatican has been waiting for? Why fast-track the beatification process (even more than what John Paul II did himself) of a man who is held responsible by many for turning a blind eye to growing reports of clergy abuse? And as more information about the private practices of JPII come to light that pose far more questions than they answer? The pieces just don't quite fit for me, and I, for one, am left with a sense of uneasiness about this entire matter. It just smacks of Vatican politics more than anything else.
The read more history.
The read more history.
Really, after Saint John the
Really, after Saint John the Baptist, what other saints do we really require, as we refuse to hear even him, this din of ever increasing saints praises making his clarion cry in the desert ever less discernible?
"Whoever has two shirts must give one to whoever has none, and whoever has food must share it."
Did Karl Marx say that?
No. Not in those words.
It was Saint John the Baptist.
Luke 3:11
'Does the right wing need the
'Does the right wing need the affirmation that his sainthood would bestow?"
You are close to the truth. The neotrads want the stamp of "sainthood" stamped upon him so that a future Pope will have to think twice before reversing such "infallible" statements as "Women can never be ordained as priests." and "All abortion is illicit, even to save the life of the mother" to name just a few. As for the rush, it's all about getting the deed done before a smoking gun document regarding shielding pedophile priests is leaked with his signature on it.
You're right, because noone
You're right, because noone that chose an evil man to be a follower should be made a saint... oh wait, Christ chose Judas as an apostle.
Brookly Catholic Actually,
Brookly Catholic Actually, the Vatican is slowing down the process
The Sensuum fidei has been clearly expressed: Santo Subito!
yeah and that lone voice
yeah and that lone voice cries out from scarnton . . .
first it was the people, then the faithful, and now the sensuum fidei??
call it what you will, it is wrong . . .
Mr Scanlon The faithful have
Mr Scanlon The faithful have spoken; you may not want to hear it
John Paul the Great! Santo Subito! SANTO SUBIT0
If this is not the sensuum fidei, then what is?
AnonymousScrantonian on Feb.
AnonymousScrantonian on Feb. 02, 2011.
You stated:
"Mr Scanlon The faithful have spoken; you may not want to hear it
John Paul the Great! Santo Subito! SANTO SUBIT0
If this is not the sensuum fidei, then what is?"
------------------------------------------------
It was, as most of us knew it to be when we first heard it, a carefully staged production. It was just like the staged calls of "Crucify him," heard at the trial of Jesus.
hahah...you progressives live
hahah...you progressives live in a fantasy world!
Amen. He was a man who seems
Amen. He was a man who seems to have had no doubts about anything. His narcissism appeared above all as he was dragged slooowwly to his death. Unable to really govern the Church, he could not, would not let go. And so for at least five years the Church stretched with him on the rack, governed by underlings who boasted that he was alert and with it even when the rest of us saw him muttering along. Lord, give the rest of us who felt so deeply wounded by this man a chance to go to our own graves in peace. Then let those who no longer remember the coldness and the certainty proclaim him a saint.
He suffered -- from an
He suffered -- from an absence of doubt.
Whatever happend to the
Whatever happend to the deadly sin of pride?
Oh I forgot that was a sin that in most instances was atributed to men, and men of importance. John Paul was smart and never spoke of the sin of pride, but rather focused in on abortion which is mostly attributed to women. Great deflection Karol!
Wow! That is alot to ponder.
Wow! That is alot to ponder. I am very conflicted about John Paul. He was a totally God-centered individual. If he ever had theological doubts, he did not show them.
So, unlike in that respect to St. Therese of Lisieux, whom he admirably declared a Doctor of the Church, and who confessed in her autobiography to the temptation to disbelieve in the reality of an after-life. In that sense, John Paul, champion of faith and scourge of relativism, will be a less approachable saint than those we know wrestled with unbelief.
John Paul so clearly and ardently loved the Blessed Mother, and the awesome coincidence that he narrowly escaped death on May 13th, the Fatima anniversary, cannot be lightly dismissed. But, did his "Cure of Ars" approach to sexuality--Catholic Puritanism, really--reflect the will of Jesus and His Mother" or was it an unhealthy projection of his own austere and tragic upbringing?
Did he draw too much attention to his own person or was he simply following the command not to hide the light under a bushel? Is the modern papacy itself at fault? Does it take an uncharismatic man (Paul VI or BXVI) to keep the right balance separating pastor from "Rock Star"? In any event, he reigned too long and that clearly was not his fault.
The Maciel and Law matters, however, cannot be so charitably excused. Perhaps, the rush to canonize Josemaria Escriva is of the same cloth. John Paul II agreed with those who agreed with him. The path was clear to his favor--agree and do not question.
So, perhaps, he was like the girl with the golden curl--when he was good (as in opposing Communism and the "culture of death"), he was very, very good, and, when he was bad (promoting and celebrating clerical toadies, ignoring cries of abuse, and foreclsoing debate on any number of important sexual issues),he was horrid. Revisit his cause in 50 years. Santo piu tardi.
It is only a fool that would
It is only a fool that would teach without a proper resume and have knowledge of supporting facts around the issues to be taught. It is very foolish for the Church to claim that science backs them as to the time life begins. When one of my skin cells divide, there are exactly 2 living cells with all the human DNA. In fact if you would place one of those cells in an evacuated ovum and stimulate that cell properly and nourish it in a uterus, you might well clown another human with all my DNA. It happened with Dolly the Sheep.
The Church has taught many things throughout the ages some of the teachings have been an honest attempt to discern what the Holy Spirit is saying to the world. Others of those teachings have been honest attempt for clerics to gain or maintain power over people. It gets all too confusing when we have a leadership that does not have the integrity to protect our children or clean up its own Vatican bank. It seems that these men are also totally corrupt as they profess an unthinkable misogyny and homophobia.
When one thinks about some of the scientific factual observations, It is inconceivable that there is soul at the time of conception because as these zygotes increase in the number of cells to hundreds of undifferentiated globs they go through a stage referred to as a blastocyst. If successful a blastocyst will implant in a human uterus. (just as I supposed my skin cell placed in an evacuated ovum and stimulated) could do. The problem is that from 60 to 80% of all the blastocysts formed in a woman trying to conceive never are able to implant. It seems inconceivable that this many souls would simply be flushed out of a woman's system. On another very conservative web site run by the Franciscans, the priest of the Church teaching area admitted that the church has never defined when there is soul because it is an impossible task to know. Yet there are many on this board who solemnly declare that the church has defined the beginnings of soul at the moment of fertilization for almost 2000 years. The church has never defined when a soul is formed and would be foolish to attempt such a tight definition.
Michael Bender on this board believes that soul would be present at the time of gastrulation, or the time that the blastocyst begins to differentiate into cells that will form different organs. We do know that about 1/3 of all these embryos spontaneously abort causing miscarriages that a woman may only recognize as a heavy period We also know that the earliest formations of a functioning primitive brain do not occur until about 12 weeks gestation when there forms the sense of smell and taste. It is interesting that many early fathers of the church marked quickening (first movement) as a time of personhood or ensoulment. Quickening occurs at about 12 weeks. However, there is not yet any primitive mind function at such an early time in pregnancy. There are many observations of newborn infants presenting highly sophisticated minds. There are also observations of minds as early as 22 o24 weeks in a neonatal ICU. Some of these kids with a huge degree of support may actually survive outside a woman’s body. However, no one knows when personhood and soul is first present. The Sisters of Charity taught me in grammar school that no one knows. They were correct.
We do know that it is very unlikely there could be soul in the blastocyst stage or the gastrulation stage, but some time after 12 weeks as minds are developing seems much more reasonable. I was also taught either rightfully or wrongfully that the mind is a subset or part of the soul. That as the mind develops to an age of reason, people are able to judge what is sinful and what is not. We know that the mind is always in a stage of becoming something different, but even a very crippled elderly person with severe Alzheimer's disease posses at least a partially functioning or primitive mind. So if it takes a mind for personhood or ensoulment to exist, then ensoulment would seem to occur sometime after 12 weeks. It is certainly true of personhood but what of ensoulment? I think it is hard to make a case for mindless souls!
Very interesting and
Very interesting and informative comments. I wonder if "relationship" has anything to do w/ the "initiation / development" of SOUL and PERSONALITY, or otherwise called 'personhood.' What is the essence of LOVE but RELATIONSHIP?
How and when does RELATIONSHIP begin? It's all such a Mystery, isn't it? Awesome, really.
JC, please explain at further
JC, please explain at further length how you find this "very, very good:"
"opposing Communism"
when in his misplaced zeal he destroyed the future of our Church, and in his cowering catering to capitalists he encouraged the systemic corruption in the Vatican Bank, embraced Reagan and Thatcher, and enabled that master capitalist Marcial, sign, and symbol, of all of capitalism's cold, lustful evil?
Just wondering, as so often mere Christianity is persecuted as communism.
I join your excellent cry of
Santo piu tardi. adagio. pianissimo.
As for his Catholic Puritanism, was it really personally practiced? What of all of those letters quickly hidden written, including while Pope, to a young woman from his old Polish youth ski trips?
Hey, just asking . . .
Devil's Advocate won't because wojtyla did away with that worthy office, for a reason.
Opposing totalitarianism in
Opposing totalitarianism in any of its forms is good. I don't think that that is controversial at all. I hope not.
Theological doubters seldom
Theological doubters seldom express or show their doubts. It's just not politically, religiously, or theologically correct to do so, especially for anyone who has climbed the ladder of power within the church. The higher you go, the more careful you must be to ensure you can still be moved higher without being knocked backward at all. It's a very treacherous route.
John Paul so clearly and
John Paul so clearly and ardently loved the Blessed Mother, and the awesome coincidence that he narrowly escaped death on May 13th, the Fatima anniversary, cannot be lightly dismissed.
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The hagiography actually holds that Our Lady deflected the bullet away from his vital organs, just as Athena deflected the spear aimed at Diomedes, in Iliad Book 5.
What's the rush anyway. Put
What's the rush anyway. Put it on the back burner until after Pope John XXIII has been canonized. He won't mind waiting.
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