No 'Yahweh' in songs, prayers at Catholic Masses

This makes sense.

But, what will we call the Jehovah's Witnesses?

And for that matter, what should they call themselves?

I think I can speak to that. My understanding is the term Jehovah came from an earlier understanding of how vocalization in Hebrew works. Hebrew, even today is generally only written with consonants and uses a system of points to indicate vowels when it might not normally be clear. The four consonants forming the divine name are in our current system of transliteration are YHVH. In the German transliteration, where Jehovah came from they transliterate the first character as J, since in German, it creates the same sound as Y does in English hence for them JHVH. This became JeHoVaH since the thinking at the time was that certain consonants in certain positions automatically caused certain vowel sounds to follow. Today, we know that the V in ancient Hebrew was probably like the arabic W. Even further we use a different method of trying to determine vowels when none is indicated in a word we don't know. Namely, we try to pronounce the consonants together without the vowels and see where we end up after each one. Therefore when you try to pronounce YHWH, it comes out as YaHWeH -- hence the current pronunciation -- even though in Hebrew when you see the YHVH, you automatically say "Adonai". As an interesting aside, when the Greeks decided to use "Kyrios" to translate the YHVH, they initially thought the best action would be to transliterate the spoken Adonai. That didn't exactly fly because in Greek, male proper nouns have an S attached to them, hence Adonai becomes Adonis -- something that wouldn't fly in Judaism.

In terms of what the Jehova's witnesses should call themselves, well, that's something they're going to have to decide.

It won't make much difference when there are no more priests to say mass.

Do protestant churches vocalize or use the name "Yahweh" in their hymns and services?

But, what will we call the Jehovah's Witnesses?

How about heretics?

Doesn't the Jerusalem Bible use Yaweh?

And by the way, whether this suggestion is a good one or not, I am getting really tired of the Vatican's constant and heavy handed dictates on issues that could easily be resolved locally.

Don't they have something better to do?

Is this what our church leaders are spending their time on? Surely God cares more about how we treat each other than what we call Him/Her. Let's get back to basics.

Hurray! I've been trying to practice this for years now. If we need a replacement, something to say or sing, why not use the word many observant Jews use, ”Hashem,“ - ”the name“?

Oh my God, how can they do this? Jesus.

We have wars, brutality, and mayhem in this world and they are worried about a few songs. Surely God is amused at this one.

One of my favorite songs YOU ARE NEAR, and just one more reason to leave the church.

Is Rome burning yet? Don't bother me right now, I;m busy practicing my violin lessons.

Like the recent attention given to "doing the dishes" after eucharistic ministers distribute communion and prohibitions against women reading the gospel from the pulpit, these folks continue to rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic. The clergy seem to have become ever more interested in preserving the trappings of the world's oldest patriarchal monarchy. Indeed, the can't seem to find anything better to do and more's the pity. Just where do they think they are leading us?

What "ancient tradition" will the Vatican invoke next? How about they turn their attention to one that really matters like the one where women were performing priestly duties. A real solution to the current shortage of priests. It's time to focus on the real problems in the church and the world. I agree with a previous poster. "The clergy seem... ever more interested in preserving the trappings of the world's oldest patriarchal monarchy".

This is so sad. Are these men living in a cacoon somewhere? They are completely out of touch with real issues and the real women and men who are trying to live lives faithful to the Gospel. The very fact that we only use "Yahweh" in song and prayer demonstrates the very reverence they say they seek; whereas, people often swear by using "God"....I have never heard anyone swear by using "Yahweh".

They are really pathetic and, except that they take themselves very seriously and make these arbitrary and heavy-handed decisions which do have an impact on the folks in the pews, they are laughable!!! They need to read the paper, listen to the news, visit Haitii or Darfur or Zimbabwe or the slums of any major city in this country and address the injustice of homelessness and hunger and poverty and corrupt capitalism and stop worrying about hymns and how we address God!!! They need our prayers....and our disobedience!!!

One of our several choirs at St. Andrew in Portland, Oregon did "You Are Near" during the Communion several weeks ago, and I was asked to handwhistle the refrain to that song, which I was happy to do. I was still unaware of the Vatican's policy change regarding the use of "Yahweh" in our music and prayers. Yes, using musical instruments does avoid having to sing forbidden words, but that's not fair to singers (or those in the pews). There are lots of alternate words for "Yahweh," and I'm sure OCP is working on including them in future publications, even though they won't be in the next edition of "Breaking Bread." Words such as "Abba" and "Savior" would fit in syllabically but might not work theologically. Parishes can implement those word changes now, and I strongly encourage that strategy.

This is truly ridiculous. What little respect I had for religious authority is gone. This is important in the grand scheme of our church? Good Lord! Oops! At least I didn't utter the "Y" word. Come on fellow Roman Catholics. It is time we take a stand and tell the hierarchy, NO!

Is this restating of a policy that dates to 1968 really out of respect for our Jewish brethren (and sisteren) or is it just another way to chip away at Vatican II and get back to those good old medieval hymns that The Lord God Almighty obviously favors? One would like to think it to be the former but I’m afraid I suspect the later.

Instead, it's most of these comments that are sad. It's a case where the news organizations and their view readers/viewers are attempting to manufacture an issue, as if more than 0.0001% of the US Bishops energy were really spent on this. Come on. Live in Love.

A little error on the part of some free wheeling or unknowing composers years ago is what caused this tempest. They can still sell their songs, somewhere else.

hmmm. Will try this again...either a bug or some filtering going on.

The comments above are "what is sad". The cause is not the US Bishops...it's the free wheeling or unknowing composers who wrote the lyrics in the first place...or the music book editors who let these cases by.

As with so many topics...the Church steps in to correct or clarify.

This publication is either trying to create tempests...or its readers are....suggesting that the bishops are spending a lot of time focusing on this small topic.

There are a lot of emptying Episcopal churches down the street that will gladly take these songs and the commenters above.

I like "Yahweh, I know you are near too" as much as anyone but I don't require the Church to suit its policies to my likes or dislikes, in music. Not one comment in this listing has come close to addressing the real issue: should we be more reverent towards God? and if so, is refraining from using His name a good way to encourage more reverence?

Instead of speaking to that, most commenters simply "gunnysacked" the thing: reached into their reservoirs of gripes against Rome and equated this with them.
Or, there is this response: this issue isn't as important as that issue, so it shouldn't have been brought up at all. This can be used to argue against dealing with virtually all issues except the one issue I think is th e most important one, can't it? In fact, the Vatican, like any government, must deal with and does deal with thousands of issues. It's a response empty of content.
The questions people ought to consider is: should we be more reverent towards God? and if so is this a good way to encourage more reverence?

So, who's going to stop me from singing "Yahweh, I know you are near" instead of "[Fill in], I know you are near"?

All of this "name calling" (pardon the expression)really comes down to fully respecting the name of God.

As a child I was always taught that it was not respectful to address my parents, teachers or elders by their first name. This same sort of respect should apply even more so to our Heavenly Father.

I just do not see the need to address Him as if I were some sort of peer. Why not give Him all the respect we can? Who of us is worthy to call out His sacred name?

Usually I can see the viewpoint of those who are very disappointed with the Vatican but this time I have to say the Vatican is right on.

It seems to me that the cause of ecumenism with our Jewish brethren---
they ought to feel welcome and comfortable in our worship services,
and the tossing about of the Name might be one thing which prevents
that--- suggests that this is an accommodation of tradition which we
can and should make.

I've had this same concern since I was a liturgical musician in 1970's
and 1980's; still, I sang the songs as they were. But I often wondered
how a Jew would feel about it.

I agree with others that many of the recent reversals of liturgical 'abuses'
are heavy-handed and out of line.

This may be the exception to that rule.

Guys and gals, this is a tempest in a teapot. I'm the director of a choir in Virginia and I just went through the recommended song list (provided by OCP in "Today's Liturgy") for the next three months. Guess what? ONCE there was a song with the tetragrammaton YHWH involved. GIA has a policy of not using it at all. So the big deal is....???? The Vatican didn't condemn those who say YHWH to hell; no one is committing sin; if not getting to sing "YHWH I know you are near" is going to drive one out of the Church, where's the commitment in the first place? Reminds me of the discussions/arguments with my Dad during the first days after Vatican II and Latin was no longer the language of the liturgy. Funny: the faith remains the same; the beliefs are the same; all that's changed is the language involved. Asking us to be reverent and to be respectful (how many of you actually read the directive from the Congregation on Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments?) is something that I understand some American Catholics have a problem with. Deal with it.

What a crock of bullroar! Have these pampered clericalists have nothing better to concern themselves with?

Deck chairs. Titanic. Get my point?

This is a most wonderful move on the part of the Vatican. It is an effort to help bring Catholics to see the greatness of God and to respect Him more. The quality and act of respect is largely lost in today's world, and every effort to develop that in us is a most wonderful spiritual directive. Deo gratias!

As a convert from Judaism to Catholicism, I am pleased to learn that the tradition of reverencing the name of our Lord, which dates back to old testament times, continues in our Church. But had the Church taken the opposite position, I would have readily deferred to the wisdom of Peter, who acted, lest we forget, in concert with the wise counsel of his fellow Apostles. If I did not believe that this action was taken by Peter under the guidance of the Holy Spirit, I could not legitimately call myself Catholic. Too many call themselves Catholic, but stubbornly hold on to the belief that they know better than the Holy See, as if the Lord had given them the keys to heaven and hell or asked them three times to Shepherd his flock. This is a rebellious and proud spirit, which underlies all protestantism, not the humble spirit of true christianity/catholicism. Perhaps some people have taken for granted what they have been given at birth in their baptism as Catholics. Pray that you may learn to revere the name of the Lord and also his Church.

God is merely a title to show respect, just as president or Mayor or Mom or Dad. They all have their own individual names. This is how we demonstrate we know personally the person to whom we are addressing & identifying them individually. God too has a name Psalm 83:18 & Exodus 6:3 it is YHWH in the original Hebrew language texts. Jehovah wants us to use his name thus allowing it to be revealed to us 6,793 times in the text of the Hebrew scriptures & over 237 times in the original greek scriptures. All it takes is a deep research of the truth & it will be evident as to the crucial use of God's name as part of our divine worship. Don't just accept what people in high positions tell you but rather Prove what's being taught to yourselves, afterall this is what God himself wants us to do Galatians 6: & Romans 12:2. Prove that Gods name is Jehovah translated from "YHWH' & prove to yourself weather or not Jehovah wants us to use his name in worship. Pray first for Holy spirit to help you prove the truth. He won't let you down

How about reverencing the name of the Lord by loving your neighbor, promoting peace, feeding the hungry, respecting life, leading others to the faith, etc etc. The church should forget the baloney and address the real issues. People in Haiti are starving,...how does this debate help them?

In the Name of YHWH
Our Lord, said:

And truly I say to you, you shall by no means see Me until the time comes when you say, ‘Blessed is He who is coming in the Name of YHWH!’ (Luke 13:35)

How, one should say that in a Catholic Church???